618 lines
37 KiB
Plaintext
618 lines
37 KiB
Plaintext
LIST
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FILE ON
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MARGIN IS 80
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STATUS: ALL ALLOWED
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NUMBER OF LINES: 616
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1 If you are in need of help, you need but ask....
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2 *************************************************************
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3 Welcome to BWMS (BackWater Message System) Mike Day System operator
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4 ************************************************************
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5 GENERAL DISCLAIMER: BWMS IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INFORMATION
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6 PLACED ON THIS SYSTEM.
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7 BWMS was created as an electronic bill board. BWMS is a privatly owned
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8 and operated system which is currently open for use by the general public.
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9 No restrictions are placed on the use of the system. As the system is
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10 privatly owned, I retain the right to remove any and all messages which
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11 I may find offensive. Because of the limited size of the system, it will be
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12 periodically purged of er messages. (only 629 lines of data can be saved)
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13 To leave a message, type 'ENTER' and use ctrl/C or break to get out of the
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14 ENTER mode. The message is automatically stored. If after entering the
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15 message you find you made a mistake, use the replace command to replace
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16 the line. To exit from the system, type 'OFF' then hang up.
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17 Type 'HELP' to see other commands that are available on the system.
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18 ************************************************************
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19
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20 [[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[
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21 Hi there!!! this is a newcommer to
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22
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23 I just spent 40 minutes or so read
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24 (<-- thats 'reading') the messages
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25 on disk B. This System is getting
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26 More and more interesting as the days
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27 go by. (years go by?). My name is
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28 The Jedi and I just baught my very
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29 own modem. So I'll be around to bother
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30 everyone regularly. (MYUA HAHAHA...)
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31 Thie by the way is the first time I
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32 have every gotten this srewy system
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33 to behave properly for me. It is a
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34 pleasure.
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35 REMEBER: people who eat fish, hate
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36 TRS-80's.
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37 ]]]]]]]]]] The Jedi ]]]]]]]]]]]]]]
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38 =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
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39 Jedi: did you learn that from the farce?
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40 Bo
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41 =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
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42 -----------------------------------------------
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43 I'S AN OSSIFER OF THE POLICE FARCE. GIVE UP NOW,
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44 AND WE'LL TRY TO TAKE YOU ALIVE.
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45
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46 SPIKE
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47 ------------------------------------------------
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48 PS. I DON'T GET DA FISH ONE.--------------------
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49
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50 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
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51 OK, gang. Last Reminder. Inncounter tonight at 6:30 for those
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52 hitting the tubes, 8:30 or so for those who just want to party.
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53 address is 21845 SW York, about four streets off TV Hwy at 219th
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54 in ALOHA (642-7837). Succulents and Gustabilities abounding.
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55 all ages and alter-egos welcome. Even Yngvi, the nut. Distimming
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56 between consenting adults only.
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57
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58 MCKANE...I AM BEING HAUNTED BY THE GHOST OF PHILLIPE. CAN PRIMAL
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59 BELCH THERAPY HELP? WILL YO BE THERE?
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60
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61
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62 CONTREMON VALERIUS
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63 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
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64 Contremon Valerius:
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65 Thanks for halping me clear up about who killed me. I wished he wasn't dead.
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66 It's so boring around here. How would you like it if you were left as a baby
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67 for the Ninja to train? You'd probably like it even less if you were Chinese to
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68 boot, not to mention the fact that you specialized in '57 Chevy sticks. And to
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69 top all that off, I got killed by someone I didn't even see. It's just depressing
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70 All these dead people want to do is sit here and count stars and things like that. The only person who I can talk to is the
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71 warlord and all he wants to play is Go. Oh well, maybe I'll go look for Phillipe. He might want to leave some stick shifts
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72 around and terrorize the living.
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73 The Ninja
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74 ********************************************************************************
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75 LEROY ............. I'M WATCHING YOU.......
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76
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77
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78
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79 Sorry, can't make it to the party. I'm sitting up with a sick freind, the
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80 lost hebrew. 'Sallright, just a head cold.
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81 Yngvi
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82 p.s. i am not a nut, just a little crazy.
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83 >+<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+<
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84 ********************************************************************
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85 NINJA: AW, ALRIGHT. I'M SORRY I PUCHED YOUR TICKET. PHILLIPE STILL
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86 HAS ONE GET OUT OF HEAVEN FREE CARD, IF YOU CAN GET IT FROM HIM YOU
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87 CAN USE IT.
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88
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89 CONTREMON
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90 ***************************************************************************
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91 Phillipe...Phillipe...Where are you
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92 Phillipe?(Who set this thing to 40 columns?) I want to borrow your card
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93 Phillipe. Phillipe, I'm getting bored here Phillipe. Where's the card
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94 Phillipe?
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95 The Ninja
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96 ********************************************************************************
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97 !?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
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98 EVOLUTION AND PASSION!
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99 BRITISH COLUMNIST CHRISTOPHER BOOKER TAKES A NUETRAL POSITION IN THE
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100 CREATIPON-EVOLUTION CONTROVERSY. RECENTLY HE COMMENTED ON THE "PASSION"
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101 HE HAS OBSERVED ON BOTH SIDES. "THE CREATIONISTS PASSIONATELY DENY THAT
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102 THERE WAS ANY SUCH THING AS EVOLUTION," HE WROTE IN HIS "SATURDAY COLUMN"
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103 FOR LONDONS DAILY TELEGRAPH. SO HE REASONED THAT A THINKING PERSON MIGHT
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104 "TURN TO THE SCIENTIFIC WORLD FOR A MORE PLAUSIBLE , RATIONALLY ARGUED
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105 EX[PLANATION--ONLY TO FIND AN EQUAL DISPLAY OF PASION BEHINDS EVERY KIND
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106 OF 'EVOLUTIONIST' POSITION, MANY OF THEM QUITE INCOMPATIBLE WITH ONE
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107 ANOTHER."
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"THE TROUBLE IS THAT, FOR ALL THE SOPHISTICATION IT HAS
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108 GATHERED FROM RESEARCH INTO MOLECULAR BIOLOGY, DARWINIAN 'NATURAL SELEC-
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109 TION' IS JUST A THEORY," BOOKER OBSERVED, "AND FURTHERMORE, IT IS A THEORY
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110 RIDDLED WITH THE MOST ENORMOUS HOLES AND QUESTION MARKS."
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BOOKER ILLUSTRATED
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111 WITH THE PROBLEM OF "'JUMPS' IN THE EVOLUTIONARY LADDER...SUCH AS THE EMER-
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112 GENCE OF THE EYE, OR OF ALL THE FACTORS WHICH DISTINGUISH BIRDS FROM EVERY
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113 OTHER KIND OF CREATURE." HE NOTED THAT EVEN THE LATEST THEORY, WHICH SUG-
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114 GESTS RELATIVELY LARGE EVOLUTIONARY JUMPS AMOUNG ISOLATED GROUPINGS, MUST
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115 ADMIT TO "*SOME* INTERMEDIATE STAGE, OF A CREATURE LUMBERED WITH A MEMBRANE
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116 AS YET INSUFFICIENTLY DEVELOPED TO ENABLE IT TO FLY, WHILE SO RETARDING THE
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117 FORMER AGILITY...THAT IT WOULD HAVE HINDERED RATHER THAN AIDED SURVIVAL."
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118 THE COLUMNIST THEN CHARGED:
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"THE MORE ORTHODOX DARWINIANS NOT ONLY MANAAGE
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119 NOT TO 'SEE' THE IMPORTANTCE OF SUCH QUESTIONS. REVEALINGLY THE SIMPLY
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120 FALL BACK WITH REDOUBLED FERVOUR ON MERE DOGMATIC ASSERTIONS, AND TAKE
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121 REFUGE YET AGAIN IN THOSE ONE OR TWO FAVOURITE CASE-HISTORIES...WHICH SEEM
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122 TO CONFIRM THEM IN THEIR COMFORTABLE FAITH, WHILE LEAVING ALL THE REALLY
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123 INTERESTING QUESTION TOTALLY UNANSWERED.
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"THE KEY WORD IS 'FAITH.' TO THE
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124 REASONABLY DETACHED OBSERVER THERE IS NOTHING MORE OBVIOUS ABOUT DARWINIANS,
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125 IN ALL THEIR VARIETIES AND SECTS, THAN THAT ULTIMATELY THEY ARE JSUT AS
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126 MUCH RESTING THEIR ACCOUNT OF THE ORIGINS AND EVOLUTION OF LIFE ON SHEER
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127 FAITH AND UNSUBSTANTIATED BELIEF AS THE 'CREATIONISTS' THEY SO HOTLY DERIDE.
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128 "THEIR 'MYTH' IS ONE WHICH ENABLES THEM TO SEE THE WHOLE MYSTERY OF LIFE
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129 AS THE PRODUCT OF BLIND, MECHANISTIC FORCES WITHOUT ANY GUIDING 'MIND' OR
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130 'PURPOSE'--AND THAT THEREFORE WE CAN ENJOY OUR PLACE AS THE TRIUMPHANT END-
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131 PRODUCT OF THIS PROCESS WITHOUT FEELING THAT WE 'OWE IT TO ANYONE.'
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132 COMFORTING THIS MAY BE--BUT THERE IS NOTHING IN THE STRICTEST SENSE
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133 'SCIENTIFIC' ABOUT THIS SET OF BELIEFS"
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134 ANY BITES? I'M WAITING.........
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135 !?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!DEBORAH!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!??
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138 %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
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139 Aiiiiiiiiiiiaaaaaaaaaaaaaagggghhhhh (screeech)
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140 %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% A "Detached" (read nauseous) observer %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
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141 P.S. The only truley detached observer is a disembodied head
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142 %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Mr. Tim %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
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143 ***AND HE USUALLY ISN'T LOOKING************************************CV
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144
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145 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^6
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146 OK, deborah, I'll bite. The problem is evidence. I'm willing to look
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147 at anything. Even physics is lies, but they're the best lies we can
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148 come up with at the moment, and the seem to do the job. This is the
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149 underlying premis behind the "Scientific Method". Faith has nothing
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150 to do with it. Sure there may be gaps. I don't know how black holes
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151 (if they exist) should work. But there is a greater "Fit" of theory
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152 to observed fact in the evolutionary MODEL than there is in the
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153 creationist. Whenever the balance of the switches, so will scientists.
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154 This holds true for every theory from speed of light limits to
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155 nuclear particles. We go with the best lie we can find, until someont
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156 comes up with a better one.
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157
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158 GENERAL MACAIBO
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159 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^6
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160 =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
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161 THE MAIN POINT IS THAT NO MATTER WHAT YOU BELIEVE, YOU BELIEVE SOMETHING.
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162 EVEN IF YOU CHOOSE NOT TO BELIEVE THE RELIGIOUS VIEW, YOU STILL HAVE
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163 "FAITH IN SOMETHING" . DO YOU HAVE FAITH IN YOURSELF?
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164 BO
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165 =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
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166 ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
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167 deborha,you say that the key word is "FAITH" faith in what? a supreme being
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168 that controls everything? or something that at least s SEEMS posible like
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169 the evolutionary theorys? what do YOU believe in?
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170 90% of my friensds follow some religion,mostly christian,one b'hai (hello a!)
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171 and a few rajneesh.aALL insist that there religion is the correct one.
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172 as for my position on the issue,the # for american athiests is 771-xxxx,give
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174 it a call sometime.if you want to argue theology i am,
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177 The Man in Gray
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179 ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
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180 *************************************************
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181 GENERAL: IF YOU WERE TO READ WHAT YOU WROTE FROM A DETACHED POINT OF VIEW,
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182 YOU WOULD FIND THAT IT EXIBITED ALL OF THE QUALITIES OF 'FAITH' THAT HAS
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183 BEEN DISCUSED, YOUR 'FAITH' IS NOT IN THE DETAILED ACOUNTING OF FACTS
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184 THAT ARE USED TO SUPPORT THE THEORIES YOU BELIEVE, BUT RATHER THE VERY
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185 BASE OF CONCEPTS THAT YOU START FROM, THAT SOMEHOW THE CHAOS THAT THIS
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186 UNIVERSE STARTED FROM HAS BY PURE RANDOM CHANCE ORDERED ITSELF INTO THIS
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187 THING WE CALL LIFE. I AM SOMEWHAT SCEPTICAL OF THIS VIEW POINT JUST AS
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188 I AM SCEPTICAL THAT SOME SUPREME BEING WAVED HIS (HER?) MAGIC WAND AND
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189 IT ALL APPEARED READY MADE ONE DAY. I FEEL THE ANSWER IS SOMEWHERE IN
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190 THE MIDDLE OF THESE TWO EXTREMES. I MIGHT POINT OUT THAT YOUR BELIEFS ARE
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191 BASED ON SOME BASIC THINGS THAT YOU HAVE 'FAITH' IN AND YOU BUILD YOUR
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192 VEIW OF THE WORLD BASED ON THESE BELIEFS, THEY ARE USUALLY NOT 'PROVABLE'
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193 IN A SPECIFIC SENSE OTHER THEN BY REFERING TO THEMSELVES FOR PROOF.
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194 THE MOST COMMON 'PROOF' SITED IS OBSERVATION, OR COMMON SENSE. YET YOU
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195 WILL FIND THESE VERY SAME 'PROOFS' USED IN RELIGON AS WELL, YOU DO NOT ACCEPT
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196 THIER 'PROOFS' BECAUSE YOU DO NOT ACCEPT THIER CONCEPTUAL BASED, AND THEY
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197 DO NOT ACCEPT YOUR 'PROOFS' FOR THE VERY SAME REASON. THIS IS WHY SUCH
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198 DISCUSSIONS NEVER GET ANYWHERE. HOWEVER DO NOT FOOL YOURSELF IN TO THINKING
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199 THAT YOU DO NOT HAVE FAITH IN SOMETHING, YOU DO, IT IS YOUR SCEINTIFIC
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200 METHODE. EVERY MUCH OF A FAITH AS IS RELIGON. DO NOT MISTAKENLY IDENTIFY
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201 FANATISISM OR BELIEF IN A SUPREME BEING AS THE ONLY DEFINITION OF FAITH.
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202 FAITH IS BELIEVING THAT THE WORLD IS AND WILL CONTINUE TO OPERATE IN
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203 THE WAY THAT YOU SEE IT THRU YOUR OWN EYES NOTHING MORE.
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204 **************** SNOT NOSE *******************************************
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205 P.S. TRUE THAT THE PRIMAL FART IS MUCH MORE DIFFICULT TO CONTROL THE
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206 TONE OF, BUT THEN WHAT FUN IS A GOOD CULT IF EVERYBODY CAN DO YOUR
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207 THING? AFTERALL WE HAVE TO BE ABLE TO PROVE THAT WE ARE BETTER THEN
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208 THOSE SNIVELING HEATHENS SOMEHOW!
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209 *********************************************************************
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210 ????????????????????????????????????????
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211 s.n. leave the !"#$%&'() line length at
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212 80 chars,o.k.? and scarf some scopalimin
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213 dirivitives and wipe that stuff off of
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214 your nose!!
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215 i beg to differ on the issue of tonal
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216 quality,not many people can snort a
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217 couple of letres of pepsi and live
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218 sence a primal belch can takee a long
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219 time to happen this leaves more judgeing
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220 time for the tone/duration/# of people
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221 affected/etc.. also to consider is the
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222 cost/noise ratio,2 leters of coke can be
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223 had for .50 + .20 dep.2 cans of hormell
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224 extra strenth cchile costs up to 4* that
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225 much. the cost of initing new mambers of
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226 your cult would be cut 75%
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227 also consider the fermentation time,
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228 primal belch vs. primal fart.
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229
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230 primal belches take less then 5 miniuts
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231 to manufacture(personal experimentation)
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232
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233 the primal fart must wait for the action
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234 of varius enzymes/microbes/acids/etc..
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235 to fully mature.therefor the time spent
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236 in initing new cult members.
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237 75% better in every way,the doctor leroy
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238 primal belch wins!!(and it is'nt even
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239 habit forming/cancer causing)
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240
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241
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242 The Man in Gray
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243 ????????????????????????????????????????
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244 XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
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245 As darkness began to close down of the forbiding forest,
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246 Tarn and Emer paused by a friendly looking tree to rest a bit.
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247 Clasping her hand between his own, he tells her, "I just want to
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248 thank you for coming to rescue me, but are you sure you can find
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249 the way back out again?" Sighing Tarn sits back against the tree
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250 and relaxes as he can. In only a moment the days adventures
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251 takes its toll, and Tarn nods off. Sometime later he awakes to
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252 find Emer gone. Panic stricken Tarn peers about but Emer is
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253 nowhere to be found. Falling back against the tree he wraps his
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254 cloak about him and hugs his knees to his breast trembling in
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255 fear that she has abandoned him.
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256 * Tarn *
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257 XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
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258 ************************************************
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259 DEAR GRAY PERSON: SURE IT IS HABIT FORMING, WHY DO YOU THINK THEY
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260 PUT THE CAFFINE IN THAT STUFF! AS FOR CANCER CAUSING, YOU SHOULD
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261 SEE THE LAB REPORTS ON SOFTDRINK! AFTER FORCE FEEDING RATS 20 GAL
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262 OF THE STUFF A DAY FOR 4 YEARS, THE RATS DIED. OF COURSE THERE
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263 HAS BEEN SOME ARGUMENT THAT THEY DIED BY DROWNING, BUT THAT IS
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264 JUST TALK BY THE TECHNICIANS WHO PERFORMED THE TESTS, AND THEY
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265 DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT.
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266 BESIDES, I RUN A CLASS OUTFIT. NONE OF THAT CHEAP STUFF HERE WE
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267 PAY UPTO $1.50 FOR A CAN OF REAL GOOD BURNING HOT CCHILI. SURE
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268 IT TAKES LONGER FOR THE URGE TO DEVELOPE, BUT THE RESULTING
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269 COMFORT IS MORE THEN WORTH THE WAIT. AND YOU CAN'T DESTROY AS
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270 MANY WITH THE SIMPLE PRIMAL BELCH AS YOU CAN WITH THE PRIMAL FART!
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271 WHY IT'S AMAZING, IN SOME STATES THEY REQUIRE US TO WEAR MUFFLERS.
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272 ***************** SNOT NOSE *******************************************
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273 ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
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274 snot nose,living causes cancer,and as for addiction,well,i've been drinking
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275 coke/pepsi for 10 years now and i'me not addicted yet!
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276 offical flatulance rating guide.
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277 tonal quality-tonal quality shall be on a 0-10 pt. scale
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278
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279 durration-duration shall be awarded on a 0-10 pt scale with 2 pt. deductions for
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280 a start/stop(consistancy is a must!!)
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281 volume-audio volume is a prime consideration 0-15 pts.a special 10 pts. is
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282 awarded for exceding the decible level of an avarage heavy metal concert.
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283 volume-gas volume ,xard to measure w/o sophisticated devices or uncomfortable
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284 devices attached to the pf'er(mufflers)therefor this catagory is only used in
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285 final round competition.
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286 # of people affected-1 point for each member of the general public that must
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287
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288 show signs of reaction.
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289
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290 if any p.f. raises blisters on unprotected skin or corrrodes metal,20 pts.
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291
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292 if any solid or semi-solid matter is expeled during a p.f. no pts. are awarded.
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293
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294 do you stay up late at night or what,last mess.i typed was at 1:30 a.m. then
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295 you replyed by 2:30. if you answer this then i may have to become good
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296 friends with you!
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297
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298 ????? The Man in Gray
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299
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300 ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
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301 ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
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303 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< *.* >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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304 ... ALAS!!! the dragon lady seems to have gone between again
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305 perhaps to another time and/or place
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306 ... just a glimpse of flashing wings in sunlight & a whispering of sound
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307
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308
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309 Nila knew exactly what place it was where East began. In
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310 fact, every morning of her life she had seen the red sun
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311 rise over the enchanted hills and she knew that where the
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312 sun rose was the east. Though she had never before traveled
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313 away from the palace, she knew from reports that the
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314 enchanted hills were less than a day's journey on foot.
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315 She would go to the place where East began, find Truth,
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316 spend the night, and return to her accustomed life the
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317 next day. Now you should know that there is nothing at all
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318 hazardous in Nila's kingdom. It never occurred to her that
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319 she might become cold or hungry or threatened in any way.
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320 It was a very nice kingdom indeed!
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321
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322 She set out on her journey the very next morning, even
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323 before dawn. The streets of the city were freshly dewed
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324 and the fruit and flower markets were just setting out
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325 their days wares. It was a happy and cheerful time and
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326 Nila's spirits were high as she watched the spires of the
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327 city dwindle behind her. She marked her direction by the
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328 rising sun in front and her shadow behind. At noon when
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329 there was neither rising sun nor shadow for direction, she
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330 stopped to refresh herself at the river bank. She sat on a
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331 warm boulder and watched the flashing golden shapes of fish
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332 beneath the surface. For her lunch she picked a luscious
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333 mango from a nearby tree and drank the cool water of the
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334 river itself. Then she curled up for a nap in the shade.
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335 wrapping herself in her beautiful cloak of iridescent
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336 bird's feathers. For a few moment she watched the sunlight
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337 darting through the leaves in the little glade. It's
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338 looking for the shade she thought dreamily and giggled.
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339 How silly, because where the sunshine is the shade is not.
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340 She giggled again but this time it was in her sleep.
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341
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342 She did not sleep long. "Just a proper little nap", her
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343 father used to say. When she awoke she found that there
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344 was a little skiff moored to the bank right in front of
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345 her. How lovely she thought. Someone has left this boat
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346 for me to ferry myself across the river. How kind the
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347 people are in my kingdom. As she pulled the little skiff
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348 across the gently flowing water, she noticed a roughly
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349 written note pinned to a seat. It said:
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350 "When you have crossed the river, leave the boat behind."
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351 "Well now!", she said aloud, "How foolish do they think
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352 I am? I certainly wouldn't try to carry it with me."
|
||
353 She laughed at the thought of it and just then she reached
|
||
354 the other shore. Nila moored the little skiff securely for
|
||
355 the next traveller and went on her way in the pleasant
|
||
356 afternoon. She watched her shadow lengthen ahead of her,
|
||
357 pointing to the place where east began. She found it both
|
||
358 amusing and exciting to know that just by following her own
|
||
359 shadow she would eventually arrive at Truth. When the sun
|
||
360 was in front of her, it was just the opposite of course.
|
||
361
|
||
362
|
||
363 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
|
||
364
|
||
365 !?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
|
||
366 MAN IN GREY: WHEN I SAY FAITH I MEAN "ALLEGIANCE TO DUTY OR A PERSON,
|
||
367 LOYALTY, CONFIDENCE, A SYSTEM OF RELIGIOUS BELIEFS." NO MORE NO LESS.
|
||
368
|
||
369 I'M JUST THE TYPE OF PERSON THAT LIKES A GOOD STIMULATING DISCUSSION,
|
||
370 AND THEREFORE ON OCCASION I TRY TO START ONE. I AM A PEOPLE LOVER, AND
|
||
371 ENJOY ALL OPINIONS.
|
||
372 P.S. I LIKE YOUR STYLE
|
||
373 ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?DEBORAH?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
|
||
374 !(*)!+!(*)!+!(*)!+!(*)+!)!+!(*)!+!(*)!+!(*)!+(*)!(*)!+!(*)!+!(*)!+!(*)
|
||
375 WHEW! FOR THE MOST PART.... THANK GOD (OR WHOEVER)... BACKWATER IS ALMOST
|
||
376 BACK TO NORMAL. I SURE MISS THOSE DEBATES! AND ALL OF THE SR. MEMEBERS ARE
|
||
377 GREAT TO HEAR. BUT.. WHERE ARE THEY? I HAVEN'T SEEN HROTHGAR OR AARON OR
|
||
378 ANYONE ON HERE LATELY. WHERE DID EVERYONE GO??? AND DID DOM EVER RETURN? I
|
||
379 AM BACK TO STAY, AS LONG AS THE FOREM REMAINS INTERESTING.
|
||
380
|
||
381
|
||
382 !(*)!+!(*)!+!(*)!+!(*)!+!(*)!+!(*)!+!(*)!+:JODY:+!(*)!+!(*)!+!(*)!+!(*)!+!
|
||
383 ########################################
|
||
384 Deborah: Well at long last you have returned to the Inn in a form that is
|
||
385 sorely missed. I too, miss the debates, but the current one is just a rehash
|
||
386 of past encounters. The question is not ''FAITH' as that is just a word that
|
||
387 has many meanings. I for one resent the 'church' usurping the use of the
|
||
388 word for their own exclusive use.
|
||
389 All people have faith. I have it when I go to start my car in the morning
|
||
390 but it doesn't depend on some ridiculous supreme being, it depends on how
|
||
391 well I did the work on my car, or anything else. In other words I have
|
||
392 faith in the only thing that counts and that is myself. All that I do in
|
||
393 this mortality I, and nothing else is accountable for. Your brand of faith
|
||
394 is just a cop-out to life and the inability to manage for yourself, like
|
||
395 a child that has to ask it's parents for permission to do anything. That
|
||
396 is the way I see the religion question, no mater what the denomination. From
|
||
397 Christian to Shinto, Buddhist to Rajneeshi they are all the same. Just
|
||
398 out there to controll your actions through Brain-washing you into submission
|
||
399 As I have said before, if we were to do away with ALL!!! religions and
|
||
400 started living our own lives we could probably cut the incidedence of war
|
||
401 in half or better. Might even do away with it alltogether.
|
||
402
|
||
403
|
||
404 #################C.Y.M.##############################1/29/84 10:43am########
|
||
405 ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
|
||
406 General:
|
||
407 If you look at the evolutionary and the creationary theories you will
|
||
408 see that it is impossible to "prove" either one of them. However, there is
|
||
409 not a scrap of evidence that supports the theory of evolution. In fact,
|
||
410 I think that some pther scientific theories are somewhat hazy and seem to
|
||
411 be made in order to halp explain evolution. Creation, on the other hand,
|
||
412 will predict the facts and explains the facts whether you believe in it or
|
||
413 not. It is similar to belief in objects being made up of atoms. You don't
|
||
414 have to believe in it, but if you are a chemist it sure helps. (I do believe
|
||
415 in atoms) Another thing, evolution takes so much time. For some reason,
|
||
416 our society seems to believe that this planet is billons of years old. In
|
||
417 fact, there is no evidence to support this, and there is evidence to refute
|
||
418 this.
|
||
419 Dr. Buck
|
||
420 ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
|
||
421 OK, SO LET'S HEAR SOME OF THAT EVIDENCE. BY THE WAY, THERE IS INDEED MUCH
|
||
422 EVIDENCE SUPPORTING EVOLUTIONARY THEORY. DARWIN HIMSELF PRESENTED NUMBEROUS
|
||
423 POINTS SUPPORTING IT. INDEED IT WAS ONLY AFTER MUCH WORK IN THE AREA THAT
|
||
424 HE CAME TO THE CONCLUSIONS HE DID AS THE ONLY EXPLAINATION TO WHAT HE
|
||
425 OBSERVED. AS FAR AS EVOLUTION TAKING TIME, IT DOESN'T HAVE TO. ADMITTEDLY
|
||
426 SOME SCIENTISTS FEVERENTLY BELEIVE THAT IT IS ALL THROUGH THE SLOW PAINFULL
|
||
427 PROCESS OF TIME, EVEN AS THEY TALK ABOUT SUCH THINGS AS THE ALMOST OVERNIGHT
|
||
428 DISAPPEARANCE OF CERTAIN SPECIES. EVOLUTION CAN TAKE GREAT STRIDES IN SHORT
|
||
429 PERIODS OF TIME WHEN THE ENVIORMENT CHANGES RADICALY. THIS WAS ONE
|
||
430 OBSERVATION THAT DARWIN HAD AND INDEED WAS ONE OF THE PRIME OBSERVATIONS
|
||
431 WHICH CAUSED HIM TO FORMULATE HIS THEORY. AS FAR AS HOW OLD THE UNIVERSE
|
||
432 IS, THAT IS ENTIRLY IRRELIVENT. YOU WILL NOT FIND A SPECIFIC REFFERENCE
|
||
433 TO AGE ANYPLACE IN THE BIBLE OR MOST OTHER RELIGOUS BOOKS. TRUE THAT
|
||
434 SOME HIGH MUCKETY MUCKS HAVE MADE SOME STATMENTS IN THAT REGARD ON SOME
|
||
435 RATHER FLIMSY EVIDENCE, BUT THAT HARDLY IS PROOF ENOUGH TO COUNTER THE
|
||
436 SCIENTIFIC PROOFS TO THE CONTRARY. ALSO YOU SHOULD REMEMBER THAT TO GOD
|
||
437 TIME IS OF NO CONSEQUENCE. THOUGH THE BIBLE SAYS HE CREATED THE EARTH
|
||
438 IN 6 DAYS, WHO IS TO SAY WHAT A DAY IS TO GOD. INDEED IT EVEN STATES
|
||
439 ELSE WHERE THAT TO GOD A DAYS WORK HAS NO RELATION TO OUR DEFINED DAY.
|
||
440 AND WHILE I'M ON THE SUBJECT, WHY DOES GOD HAVE TO STICK TO SUCH NARROW
|
||
441 LITTLE RULES? THERE IS NOTHING THAT COUNTERS THAT HE (SHE?) COULD NOT
|
||
442 HAVE CREATED THE UNIVERSE BY THE VERY MEANS THAT SCIENTISTS CURRENTLY
|
||
443 TALK. IN FACT IF YOU WERE TO READ GENISIS CLOSLY AND WITH AN OPEN MIND
|
||
444 THE DESCRIPTION (ASSUMING YOU CAN DISCARD YOUR NAROW CONCEPT OF TIME)
|
||
445 WOULD SHOW A REMARKABLE SIMULARITY. I SEE NOTHING WRONG WITH THE BIG-
|
||
446 BANG THEORY AS RELATED TO ENLIGHTENED RELIGOUS BELIEFS, ASSUMING YOU
|
||
447 CAN ACCEPT NEW WAYS OF VIEWING THINGS. THE ONLY REAL QUESTION IS NOT
|
||
448 HOW LONG IT TOOK TO GET WHERE WE ARE, OR WETHER SOME HAIRY THUNDERER
|
||
449 DID IT WITH HIS OWN MIGHTY HANDS, BUT RATHER HOW DID IT COME INTO
|
||
450 EXISTANCE TO BEGIN WITH. WHAT WAS THERE BEFORE THE UNIVERSE EXISTED?
|
||
451 AND HOW DID THOSE RULES THAT IT SEEMS TO OPERATE UNDER COME INTO BEING?
|
||
452 THIS STUFF YOU SPEAK OF IS PENNY-ANNY IN COMPARISION. YOU WANT TO
|
||
453 TALK ABOUT COP-OUTS, TO JUST SAY THAT SOME BIG COSMIC MUFFIN DID IT
|
||
454 ALL ONE WEEK CAUSE IT WAS BORED TO DEATH AND THERE IS NO FURTHER
|
||
455 NEED TO DISCUSS IT, IS ONE OF THE BIGGEST COP-OUTS I HAVE EVER SEEN.
|
||
456 ********************* SNOT NOSE **********************************
|
||
457 =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
|
||
458 That's a very good point to consider. I'm not sure if I like your reference
|
||
459 of "religious enlightenment", though. Just because you choose to believe
|
||
460 in creation instead of evolution dosen't make you better than anyone
|
||
461 else. And I also feel that both sides should take a breather and at
|
||
462 least consider the others point of view. If you take a good look at
|
||
463 the way genesis decribes creation, as Snot Nose pointed out, it is a
|
||
464 good description of the way the scientists belive it happened, just
|
||
465 on a different time scale as we understand.
|
||
466 Also remember, if there is a God (and I believe there is), then he
|
||
467 was the one who made the rules in the first place, and he could
|
||
468 probably change them just as easily at any time he wishes. Who's to
|
||
469 say both sides aren't right?
|
||
470 Bo
|
||
471 =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
|
||
472 ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
|
||
473 I would like to see just one example of a spieces becoming another spieces
|
||
474 . Just one. Does any one out there have but one example? As for time, I
|
||
475 think that that is probably a different ball game all together, but I do
|
||
476 have some evidence and if you want to see it I'll show it but I'm am getting
|
||
477 tire of hunting and pecking so I am going to go.
|
||
478 Dr. Buck
|
||
479 ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
|
||
480 P.S. I vote for the fart. The methane can be recycled.
|
||
481 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
|
||
482 ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
|
||
483 jody,aaron is still around on other boards.i don't think that he was into
|
||
484 multi-author stories,i'll send him a message stateing that a small argument
|
||
485 is once again going on.i have no idea who
|
||
486 hrothgar is so i can not say,maby aaron can.
|
||
487
|
||
488 if we could tap jerry falwell and his immoral minority we would have all the
|
||
489 ch4(methane) we needed,therefor no need for the primal fart.
|
||
490 dr.buck,find somboebody with an apple II and boot "typing tutor" if you need
|
||
491 a copy i can send you one,it's fast easy and painless.
|
||
492 gotta go,lunch is calling(read burning).
|
||
493 The Man in Gray
|
||
494 ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
|
||
495 ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!
|
||
496 WELL IT SEEMS LIKE WE TOUCHED ON THIS ONE SEVERAL MONTHS AGO, BUT NEVER
|
||
497 GOT DOWN TO BRASS TACKS. HERE'S A COUPLE. SOMEONE STATED THAT YOU CANNOT
|
||
498 FIND A SPECIFIC REFERENCE IN THE BIBLE AS TO THE AGE OF EARTH. IF YOU'RE
|
||
499 LOOKING FOR A SPECIFIC NUMBER LIKE 1,234,567,541 YEARS, YOU'RE RIGHT,
|
||
500 THERE'S NOT ONE. BUT THE BIBLE ISN'T ABOUT THE BEGINNING OF THE PLANET,
|
||
501 OR THE UNIVERSE FOR THAT MATTER. THE BIG BANG THEORY OR ANY OTHER FOR
|
||
502 THAT MATTER COULD BE TRUE. BUT WE CAN FIND OUT THE LENGTH OF EACH
|
||
503 CREATIVE DAY. AS WAS ALSO PREVIOUSLY STATED THE CREATION ACCOUNT AGREES
|
||
504 WITH PROVED SCIENCE, IN THE ORDER OF CREATION. MORE ON THIS LATER, BUT
|
||
505 AS TO THE LENGTH OF THE CREATIVE DAYS, CONSIDER: IN THE BIBLE, AND EVEN
|
||
506 TODAY IN EVERYDAY SPEECH, "DAY" CAN MEAN SIMPLY A PERIOD OF TIME. FOR
|
||
507 INSTANCE IN THE GENESIS ACCOUNT, AFTER LISTING AND DESCRIBING EACH INDI-
|
||
508 VIDUAL CREATIVE DAY, IT SAYS IN GENESIS 2:4, "THESE ARE THE GENERATIONS
|
||
509 OF THE HEAVENS AND OF THE EARTH WHEN THEY WERE CREATED, IN THE DAY THAT
|
||
510 THE LORD GOD MADE THE EARTH AND THE HEAVENS, ". THIS SHOWS THAT THE PRE-
|
||
511 VIOUS DAYS DESCRIBED COVERED GENERATIONS, AND YET THE WHOLE THING IS
|
||
512 LUMPED TOGETHER AS ONE. JUST AS WE WOULD SAY MY FATHERS DAY, OR IN MY
|
||
513 DAY, ETC.
|
||
514 FURTHER A DAY WITH GOD CAN BE A LONG TIME. SURELY A SUPREME BEING
|
||
515 WOULD BE BOUNDED BY SOMETHING HE CREATED. THEREFORE IN PSALMS 90:4,
|
||
516 IT SAYS," FOR ATHOUSAND YEARS ARE TO YOUR EYES LIKE A YESTERDAY WHEN
|
||
517 IT IS GOING BY
|
||
518 OR A WATCH IN THE NIGHT." SO IT COULD BE 1,000 YEARS OR 4 HOURS, WHICH
|
||
519 IS ABOUT THE LENGTH OF A WATCH. ALSO 2 PETER 3:8 SAYS, "BUT DO NOT YOU
|
||
520 IGNORE THIS, DEAR FRIENDS, THAT WITH THE LORD ONE DAY IS LIKE A THOUSAND,
|
||
521 YEARS, AND A THOUSAND YEARS LIKE ONE DAY."
|
||
522 NOW, IF YOU EXAMINE THE FIRST CHAPTER OF GENESIS, YOU WILL FIND THAT AT
|
||
523 THE CONCLUSION OF EACH CREATIVE DAY THE PHRASE ".....AND THERE CAME TO
|
||
524 BE EVENING AND THERE CAME TO BE MORNING, THE FIRST DAY." THAT'S FROM
|
||
525 VERSE 5. VERSE 8 IS THE SECOND DAY, VERSE 13 IS THE THIRD DAY, VERSE 19
|
||
526 THE FOURTH, VERSE 23 THE FIFTH, AND VERSE 31 THE SIXTH. BUT NOWHERE IN
|
||
527 THE GENESIS ACCOUNT IS THE SEVENTH, WHICH IS THE REST DAY, ENDED. IN
|
||
528 FACT SEVERAL THOUSAND YEARS LATER IN THE BOOK OF HEBREWS CHAPTER 4:3-11
|
||
529 WE FIND THAT IT WAS STILL CONTINUEING. AND IF WE CARRY THAT A LITTLE BIT
|
||
530 FARTHER IN THE FINAL BOOK, REVELATION, WE FIND THAT THE REST DAY INCLUDES
|
||
531 THE TIME PERIOD REFERED TO IN THE BIBLE AS THE THOUSAND YEAR REIGN OF
|
||
532 CHRIST.
|
||
533 ANYHEY, THE WHOLE POINT IS THAT THE BIBLE DOES NOT SUPPORT THE MIS-
|
||
534 TAKEN POPULAR IDEA OF 24 HOUR CREATIVE DAYS, THEY WERE THOUSANDS OF YEARS
|
||
535 LONG.
|
||
536 ALSO SOMEONE MENTIONED THAT DARWIN HAD GOOD ARGUMENTS FOR EVOLUTION. BUT
|
||
537 DID Y'ALL KNOW THAT HE TOO, ACKNOWLEDGED THAT SOMEWHERE ALONG THE LINE
|
||
538 SOMEONE OR SOMETHING GOT THE BALL ROLLING. IN HIS BOOK, "THE ORIGIN OF
|
||
539 SPECIES", DARWIN SAID, "HAVING BEEN ORIGINALLY BREATHED BY THE CREATOR
|
||
540 INTO A FEW FORM OR INTO ONE." PAGE 450, MENTOR EDITION.
|
||
541 HE REALIZED THAT DESIGN REQUIRES A DESIGNER. WHEW, I"M BUSHED AFTER ALL
|
||
542 THAT. HOPE IT MAKES SOME SENSE. TSK, TSK, CYM, THIS RESORTING TO NAME
|
||
543 CALLING. WE'RE ALL ALLOWED OUR OWN CHOICE OF OPINIONS YOU KNOW.
|
||
544 ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!DEBORAH!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
|
||
545 ===================================================================
|
||
546
|
||
547 DEBORAH:
|
||
548 AS FOR THE LENGTH OF A CREATIVE DAY IT WOULD HAVE TO BE MILLIONS OF
|
||
549 OYEARS LONG, NOT THOUSANDS. AND AS FOR EVIDENCE FOR EVOLUTION THERE IS
|
||
550 PLENTY: I HAVE BEEN COLLECTING FOSSILS FOR YEARS, AND IF YOU LOOK AT THE AGE
|
||
551 OF FORMATIONS AND THE FOSSILS IN THEM, YOU FIND THE SECESSION OF SPECIES
|
||
552 IS VERY CLEAR. I'M NOT SAYING THAT A SUPREME BEING DIDN'T HAVE A HAND IN
|
||
553 THIS, BUT I'M NOT SAYING ONE DID EITHER. (NOTE: 'SUPREME BEING' NOT 'GOD'
|
||
554 OR 'ALLAH' OR SOMTHING LIKE THAT, I DON'T BELIVE IN A GOD AS MOST
|
||
555 ORGANIZED RELIGIONS SAY THERE IS, THE DESCRIPTIONS TEND TO BE TO
|
||
556 COVEINIENT, AND I HAVE READ MOST OF THE BIBLE.)
|
||
557
|
||
558 RESPECTFULLY,
|
||
559 EVAN
|
||
560 ====================================================================
|
||
561 I NEED TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO GET MY LOWER CASE WORKING OVER
|
||
562 THIS CRAZY MODEM.
|
||
563 ====================================================================
|
||
564
|
||
565 IT'S NOT THE QUALITY OF TYPING THAT COUNTS, BUT WHAT IS BEING SAID.
|
||
566 ========================================================================
|
||
567 ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
|
||
568 evan,i was not commenting on the style of type only that ones typing speed
|
||
569 can be improved so as to be able to type more and not tire as fast.
|
||
570 as to the discussion at hand i am becoming hopelessly outclassed in that
|
||
571 i have not read much in the bible/koran/whatever.i do however enjoy the
|
||
572 discusion.in a previous mess. i used the word argument,a friend stated that
|
||
573 "arguments are tradeing of ignorance,discussions tradeing of knowledge"
|
||
574 i agree,so lets keep the name calling to a bare minimum.
|
||
575 i wish to thank deborah for the "style" complement also.
|
||
576
|
||
577 The Man in Gray
|
||
578 ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
|
||
579 ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
|
||
580 EVAN: MILLIONS OF YEARS. I WOULD BE VERY INTERESTED IN WHAT PROOF YOU
|
||
581 RELY ON FOR THAT FIGURE. DO YOU IN FACT BELIEVE THAT THERE WERE CREATIVE
|
||
582 DAYS?
|
||
583 !?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!DEBORAH!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
|
||
584 ====================================================================
|
||
585 GRAY:
|
||
586 IT DOSN'T MATTER IF HAVE OR HAVE NOT READ THE BIBLE OR WHATEVER, JUST
|
||
587 USE YOUR HEAD AND THINK ABOUT WHAT YOU BELIVE (OR DON'T BELIVE).
|
||
588
|
||
589 DEBORAH:
|
||
590 NO I DO NOT BELIVE IN CREATIVE DAYS, I WAS JUST CONTINUING THE DISCUSSION.
|
||
591 THE EVIDENCE FOR THE AGE OF FOSSILS IS BASED ON RADIOMETRIC DATING, USING
|
||
592 THE DECAY TIME OF VARIOUS ISOTOPES IT IS POSSIBLE TO DETERMINE THE AGE
|
||
593 OF VARIOS ROCK FORMATIONS, AND THEREFORE THE FOSSILS IN THEM. OFCOURSE
|
||
594 THERE ARE PROBLEMS WITH THE METHOD AND ERRORS CAN BE ON THE ORDER OF
|
||
595 MILLIONS OF YEARS, BUT WHEN YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT THOUSANDS OF MILLIONS
|
||
596 THIS IS ONLY A FEW PERCENT. (THE ESTIMATED AGE OF THE EARTH IS SOMEWHERE
|
||
597 AROUND 5 BILLION YEARS, THE OLDEST FOSSILS, 3.5 BILLION.)
|
||
598
|
||
599 WELL THER ARE A FEW FACTS (WELL THAT DEPENDS) TO ADD TO THE DISCUSSION,
|
||
600
|
||
601 EVAN
|
||
602
|
||
603 =================================================================
|
||
604 1234567890!@#$%^&*()_+][":?><,./;'{}=-<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+<>+abcdefghikkkkkk
|
||
605
|
||
606 I belive that every thing in the Bible is true because the Bible
|
||
607 is God's word.
|
||
608 The Bible is God's word. What he says goes!!!!!!!!!!
|
||
609 $$$$$$$$$$$###@@@!!!!@@@##$$%%%%^^^^^^^&&&&&*******((((((((((((()))__++++_______
|
||
612 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
|
||
613 PRAISE THE LORD
|
||
614 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
|
||
615 And pass the potato chips!
|
||
616 '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''
|
||
|
||
> |