264 lines
13 KiB
Plaintext
264 lines
13 KiB
Plaintext
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Conspiracy Nation -- Vol. 7 Num. 99
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======================================
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("Quid coniuratio est?")
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JAMES NORMAN || WBAI RADIO || MAY 14, 1996
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==========================================
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James Norman was featured on a "Hidden Agenda" broadcast, hosted
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by Gary Null, on WBAI Radio in New York City on May 14, 1996.
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The following is an abbreviated transcript of that interview:
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GARY NULL:
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Hi. I'm Gary Null and I'd like to welcome you to our program:
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today, continuing our series on "Hidden Agendas". This series is
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meant to explore some of the areas where we have been told an
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official version of events, and our own, in-depth investigation
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or those of the guests that I have on, shows that the official
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version should be challenged.
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You are going to hear information today that you simply will not
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believe. However: after an enormous amount of effort to
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corroborate the evidence of James Norman, my guest, I can say
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that much of what he is about to say, at least *I'm* convinced,
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is true.
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[Null next summarizes info from the previous, May 13th broadcast.
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See Conspiracy Nation, Vol. 7 Num. 98 for background.]
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JAMES NORMAN:
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It almost makes your brain hurt to think about what's been going
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on here. But the essence of it is exactly as you say: we've
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been spying on foreign banks.
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GARY NULL:
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What happened was, when they were looking into these accounts,
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looking for terrorists supposedly, they also came across some
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major U.S. legislators: Senators, House members, who had
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*enormous* amounts of money. The question is: How did they get
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all this money in these bank accounts? Why this particular
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[Swiss] bank? And that gives us an idea why many of these
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individuals, as you'll hear in a few moments, have suddenly begun
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to retire in unprecedented numbers -- so they can "spend more
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time with their families". There's some big names involved: I
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mean *major* names.
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JAMES NORMAN:
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Once these fellows [rogue CIA hackers] were able to get into
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these foreign banks and identify accounts belonging to government
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officials, satisfy themselves that it was dirty money, they, by
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obtaining the authorization codes off of these accounts (and
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given that they were numbered accounts and that there were no
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signatures required for withdrawal), they have been able to
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effect technically legitimate wire transfers of this money. And
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according to my sources, the money has been pulled back to some
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kind of holding account at the U.S. Treasury, escrowed for use by
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CIA or the intelligence community if and only if the CIA gets rid
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of a bunch of its own bad apples.
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Vince Foster's account, which we mentioned on the earlier show...
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He was found to have $2.73 million in a Swiss account. That
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money was apparently taken out by this "Fifth Column" [rogue CIA
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hackers] group right at the time that Foster was scheduled to
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make one of these periodic, curious, one-day trips to Geneva that
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he was making.
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Now the Sunday London Telegraph has reported about these curious
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trips. Based on the findings of a private investigator in
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Arkansas, whose credentials have been spoken of extremely highly,
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this guy was able to find private American Express records of
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Vince Foster that showed he had been making these periodic,
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one-day trips to Geneva every six or eight months. And on July
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1, 1993, he bought round-trip travel to Geneva and back -- but he
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cancelled that trip! He didn't make the trip. I'm told it's
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because he learned, in the process of making that trip, that the
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money had been taken out of his account. He cancelled the trip.
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And subsequently, he bought $2400 worth of travel to *somewhere*.
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We don't know where. He never lived to make that trip.
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His wife denies knowing anything about any of this.
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This apparently is when he found out he was under some kind of
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surveillance. *That* began this curious chain of events in the
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final weeks of his life, including a meeting on the eastern shore
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of Maryland with Webster Hubbell and other people from the
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Clinton administration that, in retrospect, clearly seemed
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designed to convince Vince Foster to shut up, "cop a plea", don't
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implicate anybody else. Because there were other people in the
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White House who were directly threatened by this investigation.
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Including Hillary Clinton.
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Hillary Clinton, at the Rose Law Firm, was an attorney-of-record
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for this company, Systematics: a bank data processing company, a
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front company for the National Security Agency, heavily involved
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in banking intelligence. And, as well, this company was, in
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effect, a "money laundromat" for covert funds that the
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intelligence community was moving around. It was sort of a
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well-known thing within the intelligence community that
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Systematics was, in effect, a "cyber-bank" for the intelligence
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community.
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Hillary was the attorney-of-record for the "bank" in 1978 when
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Jackson Stephens, the Arkansas billionaire who *owned* the
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company 100 percent at that time, fronting for Arab interests,
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tried to take over, on behalf of what were BCCI [Bank of Credit
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and Commerce International] people, tried to take over this
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Washington bank holding company -- then-called Financial General
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Bankshares, now called First American. (That's the bank that
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ultimately did come under BCCI control, with Clark Clifford and
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Robert Altman.)
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One of the stipulations Stephens had when he tried to make that
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acquisition was to bring in Systematics to do all the bank data
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processing for the multi-state holding company. The SEC
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[Securities and Exchange Commission] blocked that initial
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acquisition. Ultimately, we're told, Systematics *did* get
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involved with that bank after BCCI eventually was allowed to take
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control of it later on.
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Hillary, we're told by Foster in an interview in the American
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Lawyer magazine in 1992, developed an entire practice at the Rose
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Law Firm in intellectual property law -- mainly from immersing
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herself in the affairs of this company, Systematics. Clearly,
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she had more than a passing acquaintance with this stuff. When
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you talk about intellectual property law, we're talking about
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software licensing and extremely sensitive stuff like that.
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That raises a question: Could Hillary have been involved somehow
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in this espionage situation that Foster was being investigated
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for? Now I have no conclusive proof that Foster was guilty of
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espionage. All we know is that he was under investigation. He
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was under surveillance. What we *do* know is that his executive
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assistant, Deborah Gorham, testified under oath, in an interview
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by Senate investigators, that Foster had given her, shortly
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before his death, two, inch-thick ring binders of materials from
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the National Security Agency, which he had her put in Bernie
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Nussbaum's safe in the White House. Clearly, these were
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sensitive documents. And according to one Brookings Institution
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expert I talked to, and corroborated, one of these binders was
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*indeed* sensitive stuff and probably involved the codes and
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protocols by which the President would authenticate himself to
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the Pentagon in ordering military action. These are the kind of
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materials that Foster would have had no reason to have in the
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routine course of his duties as a Deputy White House Counsel. He
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did not have a high enough security clearance for them. He would
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not have had access to them. It would have required somebody
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that had access to the Oval Office or the Presidential living
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quarters to apparently even provide these things. *What* *was*
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*he* *doing* *with* *these*?? It's a question that has begged
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for an answer, or even to be asked in public in the official
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Washington hearings.
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So that has helped to put, over the whole Vince Foster case, a
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shadow of National Security Interests which helps explain the
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rather bizarre cover-up behavior of people in the government, and
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in the news media in particular, in failing to pursue the real
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nature of that case.
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What is becoming clear to me is that the political scandal here
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is so immense that the government just cannot come to grips with
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it.
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Have I seen any of the hard documents on these Swiss bank
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accounts? No, I haven't. And it's extremely frustrating to me.
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I keep talking to these sources. I say, "At some point you've
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got to let this out." In fact, what I've been told is that they
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*have* been turning over this information to Kenneth Starr,
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probably under some kind of a grant of immunity.
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There's a whole bunch of sensitivities here, questions: Could
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this stuff be used? Admissable as evidence? That's why there's
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been this basically extra-legal approach to the whole thing: get
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these people [e.g. crooked congressmen, etc.] out of office
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first, then eventually -- perhaps with a stronger Justice
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Department, willing to go after them -- they'll eventually be
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prosecuted.
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It's a heck of a way to do business. But, again... [laughs] I
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couldn't have made up this story if I tried!
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GARY NULL:
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Do you think Hillary Clinton will be indicted?
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JAMES NORMAN:
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Certainly if you "read the tea leaves" of what's been going on
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with the Starr, Senate, and House investigations, certainly it
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looks like indictments are rapidly approaching for the First
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Lady. Probably the first round would be on relatively minor
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obstruction of justice or banking-related infractions.
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The scenario I have been told by people who are involved in the
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investigations is that there will be an initial round of these
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kind of charges. Probably there would be pardons available. But
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maybe next year sometime, there could be a second round of
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indictments that would involve much more sensitive crimes, crimes
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against the state, potentially, for which there *may* be no
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pardon available.
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So the stakes here are extremely high. And we could end up with
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a situation much like Mexico right now, where their
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former-President Salinas is essentially a world wanderer, a man
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without a country right now, himself having been accused of
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being involved in maybe half-a-billion dollars worth of slush
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funds, stashed in CitiBank accounts in Switzerland.
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There's a lot of good people in the government. And in many
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agencies, I think there's an attempt now to try and finally get
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justice. I think that for years and years, good people have had
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to basically put the kibosh on investigations that would have got
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too close to high political figures. Now I think a lot of this
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information is coming out. And I think there is a serious effort
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to clean up the corruption in our government, which unfortunately
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has become of a giant magnitude: from kickbacks, payola on
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illicit drug and arms transactions, and who knows what. And
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unfortunately, the money involved now is so much more than it
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ever has been in the past. There has always been corruption;
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there will always be corruption. But the dollars involved now
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have become *so* significant that they've tainted almost
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everybody, it looks like, at high levels. And it's made it
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impossible to clean up the system.
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So that's why this "Fifth Column" group has resorted to this
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extra-legal approach. And I don't endorse it necessarily. But I
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have to say, "Hats off" to 'em. It looks like it's being
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dramatically effective.
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+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
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If you would like to know more about this explosive story, CN
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recommends the Orlin Grabbe material, currently archived at
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ftp.shout.net in subdirectory pub/users/bigred/og -- or use the
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http address, http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn.html to read it.
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I encourage distribution of "Conspiracy Nation."
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address, send a message in the form "subscribe cn-l My Name" to
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For information on how to receive the improved Conspiracy
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Nation Newsletter, send an e-mail message to bigred@shout.net
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Want to know more about Whitewater, Oklahoma City bombing, etc?
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(1) telnet prairienet.org (2) logon as "visitor" (3) go citcom
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See also: http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn.html
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See also: ftp.shout.net pub/users/bigred
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Aperi os tuum muto, et causis omnium filiorum qui pertranseunt.
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Aperi os tuum, decerne quod justum est, et judica inopem et
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pauperem. -- Liber Proverbiorum XXXI: 8-9
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