282 lines
9.7 KiB
Plaintext
282 lines
9.7 KiB
Plaintext
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Conspiracy Nation -- Vol. 7 Num. 20
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======================================
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("Quid coniuratio est?")
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BOSNIA: HOW THE STATE DEPARTMENT AND MEDIA
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HAVE FAILED AND MISLED THE AMERICAN PEOPLE
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==========================================
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Special thanks to my "Chicago connection" for sending a videotape
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of a public access program, "Broadsides", which was taped on June
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6, 1995. Host is Mr. Sherman Skolnick of the Citizens' Committee
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to Clean Up the Courts; co-host is Mr. Robert E. Cleveland, an
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attorney and associate of Mr. Skolnick. Guests are James Nagle,
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an attorney with the law firm of Querry & Harrow, Andrew B.
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Spiegel, also an attorney, and Mike Pavlovic, a Serbian-American.
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Pardon spelling errors. If you know the correct spellings, please
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let me know.
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Contact info: Andrew B. Spiegel, PO Box 396, Wheaton, IL 60187
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+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
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[...continued...]
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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So what are you saying? You're saying there's a symbolism: they
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want the world to pay attention to what's happening. They says,
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"Hey! We're not gonna harm these people but we're grabbing these
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people to make a point that *our* viewpoint is not being *heard*
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for some reason!" So now everybody says, "Why did you grab these
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people? They've got the 'U.N. thing?'" Is that it?
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ANDREW SPIEGEL:
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And the news media cannot afford -- going back to my wrestling
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analogy -- they can't afford to portray the "bad guys" as the
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"good guys"; they have to *stay* the "bad guys" to keep this
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story...
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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So your view, as would-be peacemakers, is that there are bad guys
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and good guys in that area, right?
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ANDREW SPIEGEL:
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There are bad guys. There are good guys. And there are great
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guys.
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JAMES NAGLE:
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To answer the question that you keep asking: "*Why* won't the
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United States sit down and talk with Karadzic?" Their position at
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this point [June 1995] is, they don't recognize him. Before Nixon
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went to China, we didn't recognize China. Did that mean that
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there were not a billion Chinese living over there?
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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This is not clear to a lot of Americans. *Who* does our State
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Department, our government, recognize?
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JAMES NAGLE:
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They have been dealing with, at this point, Milosovich, who is
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the leader of Yugoslavia, the former head of the Yugoslav
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Communist Party. And *he* is the one that the U.S. recognizes.
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And that's where our "declaration of independence" comes in...
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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Which one of them is accused of being a war criminal?
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ANDREW SPIEGEL:
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Well, ironically enough, Milosovich was accused as a war criminal
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*until* *they* *started* *negotiating* *with* *him*! They started
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negotiating with him and suddenly he's not a war criminal, it's
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just Karadzic and Miladich(sp?).
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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So in other words, the one *you* went to negotiate with to try to
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make a peace understanding, constitution and all that, is not
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recognized. And he's not recognized, why? Because the State
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Department doesn't take him seriously?
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ANDREW SPIEGEL:
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Well, because for one thing, as far as I'm concerned, from an
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international law basis, they have not declared themselves as an
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independent country. If they are of the constituent republic of
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Yugoslavia, then the person to talk to is Milosovich.
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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Under the Logan Act, no American citizen, private citizen, is
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supposed to negotiate foreign policy. So you went over there,
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negotiating foreign policy.
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ANDREW SPIEGEL:
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Not only were we *not* negotiating foreign policy, but I think
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it's clear even to the casual observer of the situation that
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there *is* very little foreign policy of the United States.
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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[laughs] There's no foreign policy, therefore they couldn't
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violate the Logan Act because there isn't any foreign policy one
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way or the other! Right? Is that fair?
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ANDREW SPIEGEL:
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*I* think so.
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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So where do you think the thing is going? I mean, what is the
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hopeful sign? We've seen all the bloodshed, plenty of it, on the
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television: bodies, buildings bombed. What is the hopeful sign?
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ANDREW SPIEGEL:
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Well, the hopeful sign is that the Republic of Srpska and
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Republic of Croina will adopt the "declaration of independence",
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adopt the "constitution", and create a democratic form of
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constitutional government where people can live freely regardless
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of race, religion or creed. And if they do that then, hopefully,
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it will bring peace to that troubled area of the world.
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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Well the point of the matter is that that area (you mentioned
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about democracy and all that): Have they ever *had* democracy
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there?
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ANDREW SPIEGEL:
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They have a democratic form of government in the Republic of
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Srpska now.
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And before we run out of time, let me tell you that we have tapes
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of the Croatian genocide in Bukovar(sp?) and the Croatian
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genocide perpetrated against the Serbs from 1941 to 1990. And the
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post office box has been flashed from time to time on the screen.
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If people are interested in obtaining those tapes, they should
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write there for further information. [Andrew B. Spiegel, PO Box
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396, Wheaton, IL 60187]
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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You're on an educational mission, all three of you.
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ANDREW SPIEGEL:
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Right.
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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And all three of you would go back, to try again, even though
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you've been rebuffed by the mainstream media...
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ANDREW SPIEGEL:
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I think that another point that should be made is that the
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Bosnians have hired a public relations firm to handle their side
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of the story. And they're just putting out all this information
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that is pro-Bosnian -- which is *one* of the reasons why the news
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media is so slanted.
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ROBERT CLEVELAND:
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Let me ask you this: When you went over there and were doing
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these things *pro bono*, so to speak, for [their] government and
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for [their] president, weren't you on their local TV and in their
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local paper, their media? Didn't they play that up over there?
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JAMES NAGLE:
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We were on their local TV; we were on their local radio -- both
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in the Republic of Srpska *and* in Yugoslavia.
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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So you were played up as heroes there. And you should have been
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played up as peacemakers in the United States.
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ANDREW SPIEGEL:
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Correct. When we left, I thought that we would get all kinds of
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news media coverage.
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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So if the three of you wanted to smuggle into the country and
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sell them some exotic weapons, you might have been better off;
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you would have been accepted by the United States if you were
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really three arms merchants.
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ANDREW SPIEGEL:
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The exotic piece of equipment that we tried to bring into the
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Republic of Srpska was a popcorn maker, which...
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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That they wouldn't allow into the country!?
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ANDREW SPIEGEL:
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...which the Hungarian border guards said was "a violation of
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U.N. sanctions."
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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By what stretch of the imagination were they gonna turn it into a
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weapon?
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ANDREW SPIEGEL:
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Well, when we tried to convince them that this was humanitarian
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relief, and not something that was covered by U.N. sanctions, we
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were talking about Bill Clinton. And it turns out, we learned
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later, we should have been talking about "Ben Franklin" [$100
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bills] and how many of them we'd have to give them to let us
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bring it through.
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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Let's ask our Serbian-American representative here, what do you
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think? Is there peace possible in the area? Or are they going to
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go on killing each other for another thousand years?
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MIKE PAVLOVIC:
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If we want to solve the problem, we can solve the problem.
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Twenty-four hours. I know. I am sure. But America should *see*
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*all* *sides*. They recognize only two sides and show on
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television two sides. On the Serbian side, they never show
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anything good -- only bad. Now, they must sit around the table
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and work together, and negotiate. And I *know* that we can solve
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the problem. We *stop* killing and negotiate. If we must
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negotiate for ten years, we should negotiate for ten years. And
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then, make economical war to be able... see how can economically
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go forward. And then we build again, together.
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SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
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I want to thank our three illustrious peacemakers. I hope you go
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back there and make peace. I appreciate you came on our program.
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And I thank everybody for watching "Broadsides". And call up your
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local newsfakers and ask them why these three have not been
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played up as heroes in their own country, the United States.
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Want to know more about Whitewater, Oklahoma City bombing, etc?
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(1) telnet prairienet.org (2) logon as "visitor" (3) go citcom
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See also: http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn.html
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See also: ftp.shout.net pub/users/bigred
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Aperi os tuum muto, et causis omnium filiorum qui pertranseunt.
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Aperi os tuum, decerne quod justum est, et judica inopem et
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pauperem. -- Liber Proverbiorum XXXI: 8-9
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