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                             THE GREENBAUM SPEECH

Herein is the lecture by D.C.Hammond, originally entitled

                       "Hypnosis in MPD: Ritual Abuse,"

but now usually known as the "Greenbaum Speech," delivered at the Fourth
Annual Eastern Regional Conference on Abuse and Multiple Personality, Thursday
June 25, 1992, at the Radisson Plaza Hotel, Mark Center, Alexandria, Virginia.

Sponsored by the Center for Abuse Recovery & Empowerment, The Psychiatric
Institute of Washington, D.C.  Both a tape and a transcript were at one time
available from Audio Transcripts of Alexandria, Virginia (800-338-2111).

Tapes and transcripts of other sessions from the conference are still being
sold but -- understandably -- not this one. The transcript below was made from
a privately made tape of the original lecture.

The single most remarkable thing about this speech is how little one has heard
of it in the two years since its original delivery. It is recommended that one
reads far enough at least until one finds why it's called "the Greenbaum
speech."
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In the introduction the following background information is given for
                              D. Corydon Hammond:

 B.S. M.S. Ph.D (Counseling Psychology) from the University of Utah
 Diplomate in Clinical Hypnosis, the American Board of Psychological Hypnosis
 Diplomate in Sex Therapy, the American Board of Sexology
 Clinical Supervisor and Board Examiner, American Board of Sexology
 Diplomate in Marital and Sex Therapy, American Board of Family Psychology
 Licensed Psychologist, Licensed Marital Therapist, Licensed Family Therapist,
   State of Utah
 Research Associate Professor of Physical Medicine an Rehabilitation,
   Utah School of Medicine
 Director and Founder of the Sex and Marital Therapy Clinic,
   University of Utah.
 Adjunct Associate Professor of Educational Psychology, University of
   Utah Abstract
 Editor, The American Journal of Clinical Hypnosis
 Advising Editor and Founding Member, Editorial Board, The Ericsonian
   Monograph
 Referee, The Journal of Abnormal Psychology
 1989 Presidential Award of Merit, American Society of Clinical Hypnosis
 1990 Urban Sector Award, American Society of Clinical Hypnosis
 Current President, American Society of Clinical Hypnosis
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                   ``THE GREENBAUM SPEECH of D.C. HAMMOND''

We've got a lot to cover today and let me give you a rough approximate outline
of the things that I'd like us to get into.  First, let me ask how many of you
have had at least one course or workshop on hypnosis? Can I see the hands?
Wonderful. That makes our job easier. Okay.

I want to start off by talking a little about trance-training and the use of
hypnotic phenomena with an MPD dissociative-disorder population, to talk some
about unconscious exploration, methods of doing that, the use of imagery and
symbolic imagery techniques for managing physical symptoms, input overload,
things like that. Before the day's out, I want to spend some time talking
about something I think has been completely neglected in the field of
dissociative disorder, and that's talking about methods of profound calming
for automatic hyper-arousal that's been conditioned in these patients.

We're going to spend a considerable length of time talking about age-
regression and abreaction in working through a trauma.  I'll show you with a
non-MPD patient -- some of that kind of work -- and then extrapolate from what
I find so similar and different with MPD cases. Part of that, I would add, by
the way, is that I've been very sensitive through the years about taping MPD
cases or ritual-abuse cases, part of it being that some of that feels a little
like using patients and I think that this population has been used enough.
That's part of the reason, by choice, that I don't generally videotape my
work.

I also want to talk a bunch about hypnotic relapse-prevention strategies and
post-integration therapy today. Finally, I hope to find somewhere in our time-
frame to spend on hour or so talking specifically about ritual abuse and about
mind-control programming and brainwashing -- how it's done, how to get on the
inside with that -- which is a topic that in the past I haven't been willing
to speak about publicly, have done that in small groups and in consultations,
but recently decided that it was high time that somebody started doing it. So
we're going to talk about specifics today. [Applause]

In Chicago at the first international congress where ritual abuse was talked
about I can remember thinking, "How strange and interesting."  I can recall
many people listening to an example given that somebody thought was so
idiosyncratic and rare, and all the people coming up after saying, "Gee,
you're treating one, too? You're in Seattle"...Well, I'm in Toronto...Well,
I'm in Florida...Well, I'm in Cincinnati."  I didn't know what to think at
that point. It wasn't too long after that I found my first ritual-abuse
patient in somebody I was already treating and we hadn't gotten that deep yet.

Things in that case made me very curious about the use of mind-control
techniques and hypnosis and other brainwashing techniques. So I started
studying brainwashing and some of the literature in that area and became
acquainted with, in fact, one of the people who'd written one of the better
books in that area.

Then I decided to do a survey, and from the ISSMP&D [International Society for
the Study of Multiple Personality and Dissociation] folks I picked out about a
dozen and a half therapists that I though were seeing more of that than
probably anyone else around and I started surveying them. The interview
protocol, that I had, got the same reaction almost without exception.  Those
therapists said, "You're asking questions I don't know the answers to. You're
asking more specific questions than I've ever asked my patients." Many of
those same therapists said, "Let me ask those questions and I'll get back to
you with the answer." Many of them not only got back with answers, but said,
"You've got to talk to this patient or these two patients." I ended up doing
hundreds of dollars worth of telephone interviewing. What I got out of that
was a grasp of a variety of brainwashing methods being used all over the
country.

I started to hear some similarities.  Whereas I hadn't known, to begin with,
how widespread things were, I was now getting a feeling that there were a lot
of people reporting some similar things and that there must be some degree of
communication here. Then approximately two and a half years ago I had some
material drop in my lap. My source was saying a lot of things that I knew were
accurate about some of the brainwashing, but it was telling me new material I
had no idea about.

At this point I took and decided to check it out in three ritual-abuse
patients I was seeing at the time.  Two of the three had what they were
describing, in careful inquiry without leading or contaminating.  The
fascinating thing was that as I did a telephone-consult with a therapist that
I'd been consulting for quite a number of months on an MPD case in another
state, I told her to inquire about certain things.  She said, "Well, what are
those things?"  I said, "I'm not going to tell you, because I don't want there
to be any possibility of contamination. Just come back to me and tell me what
the patient says."

She called me back two hours later, said, "I just had a double session with
this patient and there was a part of him that said, 'Oh, we're so excited. If
you know about this stuff, you know how the Cult Programmers get on the inside
and our therapy is going to go so much faster.'" Many other patients since
have had a reaction of wanting to pee their pants out of anxiety and fear
rather than thinking it was wonderful thing.  But the interesting thing was
that she then asked, "What are these things?"

They were word perfect -- same answers my source had given me. I've since
repeated that in many parts of the country. I've consulted in eleven states
and one foreign country, in some cases over the telephone, in some cases in
person, in some cases giving the therapist information ahead of time and
saying, "Be very careful how you phrase this. Phrase it in these ways so you
don't contaminate."

In other cases not even giving the therapist information ahead of time so they
couldn't. When you start to find the same highly esoteric information in
different states and different countries, from Florida to California, you
start to get an idea that there's something going on that is very large, very
well coordinated, with a great deal of communication and sytematicness to
what's happening.

So I have gone from someone kind of neutral and not knowing what to think
about it all to someone who clearly believes ritual abuse is real and that the
people who say it isn't are either naive like people who didn't want to
believe the Holocaust or -- they're dirty. [Applause]

Now for a long time I would tell a select group of therapists that I knew and
trusted, information and say, "Spread it out. Don't spread my name. Don't say
where it came from. But here's some information. Share it with other
therapists if you find it's on target, and I'd appreciate your feedback."
People would question -- in talks -- and say, you know, they were hungry for
information.  Myself, as well as a few others that I've shared it with, were
hedging out of concern and out of personal threats and out of death threats. I
finally decided to hell with them.

If they're going to kill me, they're going to kill me. It's time to share more
information with therapists. Part of that comes because we proceeded so
cautiously and slowly, checking things in many different locations and find
the same thing. So I'm going to give you the way in with ritual-abuse
programming. I certainly can't tell you everything that you want to know in
forty-five or fifty minutes, but I'm going to give you the essentials to get
inside and start working at a new level.

I don't know what proportion, honestly, of patients have this. I would guess
that maybe somewhere around at least fifty percent, maybe as high as three-
quarters, I would guess maybe two-thirds of your ritual-abuse patients may
have this. What do I think the distinguishing characteristic is?

If they were raised from birth in a mainstream cult or if they were an non-
bloodline person, meaning neither parent was in the Cult, but Cult people had
a lot of access to them in early childhood, they may also have it. I have seen
more than one ritual-abuse patient who clearly had all the kind of ritual
things you hear about. They seemed very genuine. They talked about all the
typical things that you hear in this population, but had none of this
programming with prolonged extensive checking.

So I believe in one case I was personally treating that she was a kind of
schismatic break-off that had kind of gone off and done their own thing and
were no longer hooked into a mainstream group. [Pause]

Here's where it appears to have come from. At the end of World War II, before
it even ended, Allen Dulles and people from our Intelligence Community were
already in Switzerland making contact to get out Nazi scientists.  As World
War II ends, they not only get out rocket scientists, but they also get out
some Nazi doctors who have been doing mind-control research in the camps.

They brought them to the United States. Along with them was a young boy, a
teenager, who had been raised in a Hasidic Jewish tradition and a background
of Cabalistic mysticism that probably appealed to people in the Cult because
at least by the turn of the century Aleister Crowley had been introducing
Cabalism into Satanic stuff, if not earlier. I suspect it may have formed some
bond between them. But he saved his skin by collaborating and being an
assistant to them in the death-camp experiments. They brought him with them.

They started doing mind-control research for Military Intelligence in military
hospitals in the United States. The people that came, the Nazi doctors, were
Satanists.  Subsequently, the boy changed his name, Americanized it some,
obtained an M.D. degree, became a physician and continued this work that
appears to be at the center of Cult Programming today. His name is known to
patients throughout the country. [Pause]

What they basically do is they will get a child and they will start this, in
basic forms, it appears, by about two and a half after the child's already
been made dissociative. They'll make him dissociative not only through abuse,
like sexual abuse, but also things like putting a mousetrap on their fingers
and teaching the parents, "You do not go in until the child stops crying. Only
then do you go in and remove it."

They start in rudimentary forms at about two and a half and kick into high
gear, it appears, around six or six and a half, continue through adolescence
with periodic reinforcements in adulthood. Basically in the programming the
child will be put typically on a gurney. They will have an IV in one hand or
arm. They'll be strapped down, typically naked. There'll be wires attached to
their head to monitor electroencephalograph patterns. They will see a pulsing
light, most often described as red, occasionally white or blue. They'll be
given, most commonly I believe, Demerol. Sometimes it'll be other drugs as
well depending on the kind of programming.

They have it, I think, down to a science where they've learned you give so
much every twenty-five minutes until the programming is done. They then will
describe a pain on one ear, their right ear generally, where it appears a
needle has been placed, and they will hear weird, disorienting sounds in that
ear while they see photic stimulation to drive the brain into a brainwave
pattern with a pulsing light at a certain frequency not unlike the goggles
that are now available through Sharper Image and some of those kinds of
stores.

Then, after a suitable period when they're in a certain brainwave state, they
will begin programming, programming oriented to self-destruction and
debasement of the person. In a patient at this point in time about eight years
old who has gone through a great deal early programming took place on a
military installation. That's not uncommon. I've treated and been involved
with cases who are part of this original mind-control project as well as
having their programming on military reservations in many cases.

We find a lot of connections with the CIA. This patient now was in a Cult
school, a private Cult school where several of these sessions occurred a week.
She would go into a room, get all hooked up. They would do all of these sorts
of things. When she was in the proper altered state, now they were no longer
having to monitor it with electroencephalographs, she also had already had
placed on her electrodes, one in the vagina, for example, four on the head.

Sometimes they'll be on other parts of the body. They will then begin and they
would say to her, "You are angry with someone in the group." She'd say, "No,
I'm not" and they'd violently shock her. They would say the same thing until
she complied and didn't make any negative response. Then they would continue.
"And because you are angry with someone in the group," or "When you are angry
with someone in the group, you will hurt yourself. Do you understand?" She
said, "No" and they shocked her.  They repeated again, "Do you understand?"

"Well, yes, but I don't want to."  Shock her again until they get compliance.
Then they keep adding to it. "And you will hurt yourself by cutting yourself.
Do you understand?" Maybe she'd say yes, but they might say, "We don't believe
you" and shock her anyway. "Go back and go over it again." They would continue
in this sort of fashion. She said typically it seemed as though they'd go
about thirty minutes, take a break for a smoke or something, come back. They
may review what they'd done and stopped or they might review what they'd done
and go on to new material.

She said the sessions might go half an hour, they might go three hours. She
estimated three times a week. Programming under the influence of drugs in a
certain brainwave state and with these noises in one ear and them speaking in
the other ear, usually the left ear, associated with right hemisphere non-
dominant brain functioning, and with them talking, therefore, and requiring
intense concentration, intense focusing. Because often they'll have to
memorize and say certain things back, word-perfect, to avoid punishment,
shock, and other kinds of things that are occurring.

This is basically how a lot of programming goes on. Some of it'll also use
other typical brainwashing kinds of techniques. There will be very
standardized types of hypnotic things done at times. There'll be sensory
deprivation which we know increases suggestibility in anyone.  Total sensory
deprivation, suggestibility has significantly increased, from the research.

It's not uncommon for them to use a great deal of that, including formal
sensory-deprivation chambers before they do certain of these things.  [Pause]
Now let me give you, because we don't have a lot of time, as much practical
information as I can. The way that I would inquire as to whether or not some
of this might be there would be with ideomotor finger-signals.

After you've set them up I would say, "I want the central inner core of you to
take control of the finger-signals." Don't ask the unconscious mind. The case
where you're inquiring about ritual abuse, that's for the central inner core.

The core is a Cult-created part. "And I want that central inner core of you to
take control of this hand of these finger-signals and what it has for the yes-
finger to float up. I want to ask the inner core of you is there any part of
you, any part of Mary," that's the host's name, "who knows anything about
Alpha, Beta, Delta, or Theta."

If you get a Yes, it should raise a red flag that you might have someone with
formal intensive brainwashing and programming in place. I would then ask and
say, "I want a part inside who knows something about Alpha, Beta, Delta, and
Theta to come up to a level where you can speak to me and when you're here
say, 'I'm here.'" I would not ask if a part was willing to. No one's going to
particularly want to talk about this. I would just say, "I want some part who
can tell me about this to come out."

Without leading them ask them what these things are. I've had consults where
I've come in. Sometimes I've gotten a Yes to that, but as I've done
exploration it appeared to be some kind of compliance response or somebody
wanting, in two or three cases, to appear maybe that they were ritual abuse
and maybe they were in some way, but with careful inquiry and looking it was
obvious that they did not have what we were looking for. Let me tell you what
these are.

Let's suppose that this whole front row here are multiples and that she has an
alter named Helen and she has one named Mary, she has one named Gertrude, she
has one named Elizabeth, and she has one named Monica. Every one of those
alters may have put on it a program, perhaps designated alpha-zero-zero-nine a
Cult person could say, "Alpha-zero-zero-nine" or make some kind of hand
gesture to indicate this and get the same part out in any one of them even
though they had different names that they may be known by to you.

Alphas appear to represent general programming, the first kind of things put
in. Betas appear to be sexual programs. For example, how to perform oral sex
in a certain way, how to perform sex in rituals, having to do with producing
child pornography, directing child pornography, prostitution.

Deltas are killers trained in how to kill in ceremonies.  There'll also be
some self-harm stuff mixed in with that, assassination and killing. Thetas are
called psychic killers. You know, I had never in my life heard those two terms
paired together.  I'd never heard the words "psychic killers" put together,
but when you have people in different states, including therapists inquiring
and asking, "What is Theta," and patients say to them, "Psychic killers," it
tends to make one a believer that certain things are very systematic and very
widespread. This comes from their belief in psychic sorts of abilities and
powers, including their ability to psychically communicate with "mother'"
including their ability to psychically cause somebody to develop a brain
aneurysm and die.  It also is a more future-oriented kind of programming.

Then there's Omega. I usually don't include that word when I say my first
question about this or any part inside that knows about Alpha, Beta, Delta,
Theta because Omega will shake them even more. Omega has to do with self-
destruct programming. Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. This can
include self-mutilation as well as killing-themselves programming. Gamma
appears to be system-protection and deception programming which will provide
misinformation to you, try to misdirect you, tell you half-truths, protect
different things inside.  There can also be other Greek letters.

I'd recommend that you go and get your entire Greek alphabet and if you have
verified that some of this stuff is present and they have given you some of
the right answers about what some of this material is, and I can't underline
enough: DO NOT LEAD THEM. Do not say, "Is this killers?" Get the answer from
them, please.

When you've done this and it appears to be present, I would take your entire
Greek alphabet and, with ideomotor signals, go through the alphabet and say,
"Is there any programming inside associated with epsilon, omicron," and go on
through.  There may be some sytematicness to some of the other letter, but I'm
not aware of it.

I've found, for example, in one case that Zeta had to do with the production
of snuff films that this person was involved with. With another person,
Omicron had to do with their linkage and associations with drug smuggling and
with the Mafia and with big business and government leaders. So there's going
to be some individualism, I think, in some of those. Some of those are come-
home programs, "come back to the Cult", "return to the Cult" program.

Here's the flaw in the system. They have built in shut-down and erasure codes
so if they got into trouble they could shut something down and they could also
erase something. These codes will sometimes be idiosyncratic phrases, or
ditties. Sometimes they will be numbers maybe followed by a word.  There's
some real individuality to that. At first I had hoped if we can get some of
these maybe they'll work with different people. No such luck. It's very
unlikely unless they were programmed at about the same point in time as part
of the same little group.

Stuff that I've seen suggests that they carry laptop computers, the
programmers, which still include everything that they did twenty, thirty years
ago in them in terms of the names of alters, the programs, the codes, and so
on. Now what you can do is get erasure codes, and I always ask, "If I say this
code, what will happen?'  Doublecheck. "Is there any part inside who has
different information?"  Watch your ideomotor signals and what I've found is
you can erase programs by giving the appropriate codes, but then you must
abreact the feelings.

So if you erase Omega, which is often where I've started because it's the most
high risk. Afterwards I will get all the Omega, what were formerly Omega
alters, together so that we will abreact and give back to the host the
memories associated with all the programming that was done with Omega and
anything any Omega part ever had to do in a fractionated abreaction. They use
the metaphor -- and it is their metaphor -- of robots. And it is like a robot
shell comes down over the child alter to make them act in robotic fashion.

Once in a while internally you'll confront robots. What I found from earlier
work, and so I speed the process up now because I confirmed it enough times,
is that you can say to the core, "Core, I want you to look -- there's this
robot blocking the way in some way, blocking the progress. Go around and look
at the back of the head and tell me what you notice on the back of the head or
the neck." I just ask it very non-leading like that and what's commonly said
to me is that there were wires or a switch. So I'll tell them, "Hold the wires
or flip the switch and it will immobilize the robot and give me a yes-signal
when you've done it."  Pretty soon you get a yes-signal. "Great. Now that the
robot is immobilized, I want you to look inside the robot and tell me what you
see."

It's generally one or several children. I have them remove the children.  I do
a little hypnotic magic and ask the core to use a laser and vaporize the robot
so nothing is left. They're usually quite amazed that this works, as have been
a number of therapists. [Pause]

Now there are many different layers of this stuff is the problem. Let me come
over to the overhead and give some ideas about them.  What we have up here are
innumerable alters. I'll tell you one of the fascinating things I've seen. I
remember a little over a year ago coming in to see some cases, some of the
tough cases at a dissociative-disorders unit of a couple of the finest of the
MPD therapists in this country, who are always part of all the international
meetings, have lectured internationally.

We worked and I look at some of their patients. They were amazed at certain
things because they had not been aware of this before. As we worked with some
of the patients and confirmed it, I remember one woman who'd been inpatient
for three years, still was inpatient. Another who had one intensive year of
inpatient work with all the finest MPD therapy you can imagine -- abreactions,
integrations, facilitating cooperation, art therapy, on and on and on,
journaling, intensively for one inpatient year followed by an intensive year
of outpatient therapy two, three hours a week.

In both patients we found out that all of this great work had done nothing but
deal with the alters up here and had not touched the mind-control programming.
In fact it was not only intact, but we found that the one who was outpatient
was having her therapy monitored every session by her mother, out-of-state,
over the telephone, and that she still had intact suggestions that had been
give to her at a certain future time to kill her therapist. Now one of the
things that I would very carefully check is, I would suggest that you ask the
core, not just the unconscious mind, ask the core, "Is there any part inside
that continues to have contact with people associated with the Cult? Is there
any part inside who goes to Cult rituals or meetings? Is there a recording
device inside of Mary," if that's the host's name, "a recording device inside
so that someone can find out the things that are said in sessions?"

This doesn't mean they're monitored. Many of them just simply have it. "Is
there someone who debriefs some part inside for what happens in our therapy
sessions?" I have the very uncomfortable feeling from some past experience
that when you look at this you will find the large proportion of ritual-abuse
victims in this country are having their ongoing therapy monitored.

I remember a woman who came in about twenty-four years old, claimed her father
was a Satanist. Her parents divorced when she was six. After that it would
only when her father had visitation and he would take her to rituals sometimes
up until age fifteen. She said, "I haven't gone to anything since I was
fifteen." Her therapist believed this at face value. We sat in my office. We
did a two-hour inquiry using hypnosis. We found the programming present.

In addition to that we found that every therapy session was debriefed and in
fact they had told her to get sick and not come to the appointment with me.
Another one had been told that I was Cult and that if she came I would know
that she'd been told not to come and I would punish her. If anything
meaningful comes out in a patient who's being monitored like that -- from what
I've learned thus far, they're tortured with electric shocks -- my belief is
if they're in that situation you can't do meaningful therapy other than being
supportive and caring and letting them know you care a lot and you'll be there
to support them. But I wouldn't try to work with any kind of deep material or
deprogramming with them because I think it can do nothing but get them
tortured and hurt unless they can get into a safe, secure inpatient unit for
an extended period of time to do some of the work required.

I have a feeling that when you make inquiries you're going to find that
probably greater than fifty percent of these patients, if they're bloodline,
meaning mother or dad or both involved, will be monitored on some ongoing
basis. [Pause]

Now when you come below the alters, you then have Alpha, Beta, Delta, Theta,
so and so forth, the Greek-letter programming and they will then have backup
programs.  There will typically be an erasure code for the backups.  There may
be one code that combines all the backups into one and then an erasure code
for them, simply one code that erases all the backups.  So I will get the code
for, let's say, Omega and for all the Omega backups at the same time. After
I've asked "What will happen if I give this," I will give the code and then I
will say, "What are you experiencing?" They often describe computer whirring,
things erasing, explosions inside, all sorts of interesting things.

I've had some therapists come back and say, "My Lord, I had never said
anything about robots and she said something about robots vaporizing." I
remember one therapist who'd been with me in several hypnosis workshops and
consulted with me about a crisis MPD situation. I told her to inquire about
Alpha, Beta, Delta, Theta. She did. She got back to me saying, "Yeah, I got an
indication it's there. What is it?" I said, "I'm not going to tell you. Go
back and inquire about some of this."

We set an appointment for a week or so hence. She got back with me and said,
"I asked what Theta was and she said, 'psychic killers.' I asked her what
Delta was and she said 'killers.'" Okay. So I told her about some of this
stuff for a two-hour consult. She called back and she said, "This seemed too
fantastic. I heard this and I thought, 'Has Cory been working too hard?'"  she
said, I'm embarrassed to admit it, but she said, "I held you in high
professional regard, but this just sounded so off in the twilight zone that I
really thought, 'Is he having a nervous breakdown or something?'"

She said, "But I respected you enough to ask about this." She said, "I asked
another MPD patient and she didn't have any of this." So in this patient she
started describing things and how she worked, for example, with an erasure and
she was describing things like robots vaporizing and kinds of things.  She
said, "I hadn't told her about any of these things." Well, here's the problem.
There are different layers and I think some of them are designed to keep us
going in circles forever. They figured we probably, in most cases, wouldn't
get below the alters which they purposefully created.

The way you create Manchurian Candidates is you divide the mind.  It's part of
what the Intelligence Community wanted to look at. If you're going to get an
assassin, you're going to get somebody to go do something, YOU DIVIDE THE
MIND.

It fascinates me about cases like the assassination of Robert Kennedy, where
Bernard Diamond, on examining Sirhan Sirhan found that he had total amnesia of
the killing of Robert Kennedy, but under hypnosis could remember it.  But
despite suggestions he would be able to consciously remember, could not
remember a thing after was out of hypnosis. I'd love to examine Sirhan Sirhan.

It appears that below this we've got some other layers. One is called "Green
Programming" it appears. Isn't it interesting that the doctor's name is Dr.
Green? One of the questions in a way that does not contaminate is after I've
identified some of this stuff is there and they've given me a few right
answers about what some of it is, "If there were a doctor associated with this
programming and his name were a color, you know, like Dr.  Chartreuse or
something, if his name were a color, what color would the color be?"

Now once in a while I've had some other colors mentioned in about three or
four patients that I felt were trying to dissimulate in some way and I don't
really believe had this. In one case I got another color and I found out later
it was a doctor whose name was a color who was being trained by Dr. Green
almost thirty years ago and he supervised part of the programming of this
woman under this doctor.

I remember one woman couldn't come up with anything.  No alter would speak up
with anything. I said, "Okay," and we went on to some other material.  About
two minutes later she said, "Green. Do you mean Dr. Green?" We found this all
over. There appears to be some Green Programming below that and I suspect that
you get down to fewer and more central programs the deeper you go.

Well, all Green Programming is Ultra-Green and the Green Tree. Cabalistic
mysticism is mixed all into this. If you're going to work with this you need
to pick up a couple of books on the Cabala. One is by a man named Dion Fortune
called "Qabala" with a "q," Dion Fortune. Another is by Ann Williams-Heller
and it's called "The Kabbalah."

I knew nothing about the Cabala. It was interesting. A patient had sat in my
waiting area, got there considerably early and drew a detailed multicolored
Cabalistic Tree over two years ago. It took me two months to figure out what
it was. Finally, showing it to somebody else who said, "You know? That looks
an awful lot like the Cabala Tree" and that rang a bell with some esoteric in
an old book and I dug it out. That was the background of Dr. Green.

Now the interesting thing about the Green Tree is his original name was
Greenbaum. What does "greenbaum" mean in German? Green Tree, Ultra-Tree and
the Green Tree. I've also had patients who didn't appear to know that his
original name was Greenbaum, volunteered that there were parts inside named
Mr.  Greenbaum. Now let me give you some information about parts inside that
may be helpful to you if you're going to inquire about these things, because
my experience is one part will give you some information and either run dry or
get defensive or scared and stop. And so you punt and you make an end run and
you come around the other direction, you find another part.

I'll tell you several parts to ask for and ask if there's a part by this name.
And, by the way, when I'm screening patients and fiddling around with this, I
throw in a bunch of spurious ones and ask, "Is there a part inside by this
name and by that name" as a check on whether or not it appears genuine. For
example. "In addition to the core," I ask, "is there a part inside named
Wisdom?" Wisdom is a part of the Cabalistic Tree.

Wisdom, I've often found, will be helpful and give you a lot of information.
"Is there a part inside named Diana?" I mean I may throw in all sorts of
things. "Is there a part inside named Zelda?" I've never encountered one yet!
Just to see what kind of answers we get. I try to do this carefully.  Diana is
a part that, in the Cabalistic system, is associated with a part called the
Foundation. You will be fascinated to know that.

Remember the Process Church?  Roman Polanski's wife, Sharon Tate, was killed
by the Manson Family who were associated with the Process Church? A lot of
prominent people in Hollywood were associated and then they went underground,
the books say, in about seventy-eight and vanished?

Well, they're alive and well in southern Utah. We have a thick file in the
Utah Department of Public Safety documenting that they moved to southern Utah,
north of Monument Valley, bought a movie ranch in the desert, renovated it,
expanded it, built a bunch of buildings there, carefully monitored so that
very few people go out of there and no one can get in and changed their name.

A key word in their name is "Foundation." The Foundation.  There are some
other words. The Foundation is part of the Tree. So you can ask, "Is there
something inside known as The Foundation?" I might ask other things to throw
people off. "Is there something known as the Sub-Basement?" Well, maybe
they'll conceive of something. Or "Is there something known as the Walls?"

There are a variety of questions you can come up with, to sort of screen some
things.  I've also found that there will often be a part called "Black
Master," a part called "Master Programmer," and that there will be computer
operators inside.  How many of you have come into computer things in patients?
There will typically be computer operators: Computer Operator Black, Computer
Operator Green, Computer Operator Purple.

Sometimes they'll have numbers instead, sometimes they'll be called Systems
Information Directors. You can find out the head one of those. There'll be a
source of some information for you. I will ask inside, "Is there a part inside
named Dr. Green?" You'll find that there are, if they have this kind of
programming, in my experience. Usually with a little work and reframing, you
can turn them and help them to realize that they were really a child-part
who's playing a role and they had no choice then, but they do now.  You know,
they played their role very, very well, but they don't have to continue to
play it with you because they're safe here and in fact, "If the Cult simply
found out that you talked to me, that they you had shared information with me,
you tell me what would they do to you?"

Emphasize that the only way out is through me and that they need to cooperate
and share information and help me and that I'll help them. So all these parts
can give you various information. Now they have tried to protect this very
carefully. Let me give you an example with Ultra-Green. I discovered this --
by the way I used to think this programming was only in bloodline people. I've
discovered it in non-bloodline people, but it's a bit different. They don't
want it to be just the same. I don't think you'll find deep things like Ultra-
Green and probably not even Green Programming with non-bloodline people.

But let me tell you something that I discovered first in a non-bloodline and
then in a bloodline. We were going along and a patient was close to getting
well, approaching final integration in a non-bloodline and she suddenly
started hallucinating and her fingers were becoming hammers and other things
like that. So I used an affect-bridge and we went back and we found that what
happened was that they gave suggestions, that if she ever got well to a
certain point she would go crazy.

The way they did this was they strapped her down and they gave her LSD when
she was eight years old. When she began hallucinating they inquired about the
nature of the hallucinations so they could utilize them in good Ericsonian
fashion and build on them and then combine the drug-effect with powerful
suggestions. "If you ever get to this point you will go crazy. If you ever get
fully integrated and get well you will go crazy like this and will be locked
up in an institution for the rest of your life. They gave those suggestions
vigorously and repetitively.  Finally they introduced other suggestions that,
"Rather than have this happen, it would be easier to just kill yourself."
In a bloodline patient then, as I began inquiring about deep material, the
patient started to experience similar symptoms. We went back and we found the
identical things were done to her.

This was called the "Green Bomb."  B-O-M-B. Lots of interesting internal
consistencies like that play on words with Dr. Greenbaum, his original name.
Now in this case it was done to her at age nine for the first time and then
only hers was different. Hers was a suggestion for amnesia.  "If you ever
remember anything about Ultra-Green and the Green Tree you will go crazy. You
will become a vegetable and be locked up forever." Then finally the
suggestions added, "And it'll be easier to just kill yourself than have that
happen to you, if you ever remember it." At age twelve then, three years
later, they used what sounds like an Amytol interview to try to breach the
amnesia and find out if they could. They couldn't.

So then they strapped her down again, took and gave her something to kind of
paralyze her body, gave her LSD, an even bigger dose and reinforced all the
suggestions. Did a similar thing at the age of sixteen.  So these are some of
the kind of booby traps you run into. There are a number of cases where they
combined powerful drug effects like this with suggestions to keep us from
discovering some of this deeper level stuff.

What's the bottom?  Your guess is as good as mine but I can tell you that I've
had a lot of therapists who were stymied with these cases who were going
nowhere. In fact someone here that I told some basic information about this to
in Ohio a couple of months ago said it opened all sorts of things up in a
patient who'd been going nowhere. That's an often common thing. I think that
we can move down to deeper levels and if we deal with some of the deeper level
stuff it may destroy all the stuff above it. But we don't even know that yet.

In some of the patients I'm working with we have pretty much dealt with a lot
of the top-level stuff. I'll tell you how we've done some of that.  We'll take
and erase one system like Omega. Then we will have a huge abreaction of all
the memories and feelings in a fractionated abreaction associated with those
parts. I typically find I'll say to them, "Now that we've done this are there
any other memories and feelings that any parts that were Omega still have?"
The answer's usually "No." At that point I will say, "I usually find at this
point in time the majority, if not all, of those parts that used to be Omega
no longer feel a desire or need to be different, realizing that you split off
originally by them and want to go home to Mary and become one with her again."

I use the concept often now -- which came from a patient -- of going home and
becoming one with her. "Going back from whence you came" is another phrase
I'll use with them. "Are there any Omega parts inside who do not feel
comfortable with that or have reservations or concerns about that?" If there
are we talk to them. We deal with them. A few may not integrate.

My experience is most of the time they'll integrate and we may integrate
twenty-five parts at once in a polyfragmented complex MPD. I think it is
vitally important to abreact the feelings before you go on. Also for many
patients it hasn't seemed to matter the order we go in but I've found a couple
where it has. If it doesn't seem to matter I'll typically go Omega, then Delta
because they have more violence potential, then Gamma to get rid of the self-
deception stuff.

What I will do before I just assume anything and do that, is once we've done
Omega and showed them that success can occur and something can happen and they
feel relief after, I will say to them, "I want to ask the core -- through the
fingers -- is there a specific order in which programs must be erased?" You
know maybe it doesn't matter but most of the time I found "No."  There are
cases where we found "Yes."

I recommend doing one or two or three of those because they'll produce relief
and a sense of optimism in the patient.  But then I would recommend starting
to probe for the deeper level things and getting their input and
recommendations about the order in which we go.  Question?

Q: What has been the typical age and typical gender of this type of
   person?

Dr.H: I know of this being found in men and women. Most of the patients I know
      with MPD ritual abuse that are being treated are women, however. I know
      of some men being treated where we've found this. A while back I was
      talking to a small group of therapists somewhere. I told them about some
      of this. In the middle of talking about some of this all the color
      drained out of one social worker's face and she obviously had a reaction
      and I asked her about and she said, "I'm working with a five-year-old
      boy," and she said, "Just in the last few weeks he was saying something
      about a Dr. Green." I went on a little further and I mentioned some of
      these things and she just shook her head again. I said, "What's going
      on?" She said, "He's been spontaneously telling me about robots and
      about Omega." I think you will find variations of this and that they've
      changed it, probably every few years and maybe somewhat regionally to
      throw us off in various ways but that certain basics and fundamentals
      will probably be there. I have seen this in people up into their forties
      including people whose parents were very, very high in the CIA, other
      sorts of things like that. I've had some that were originally part of
      the Monarch Project which is the name of the government Intelligence
      project. Question in the back?

Q: I'm still not grasping how one starts, how you find out how to erase. How
   do you get that information?

Dr.H: I would say, "I want the core, if necessary, using the telepathic
      communication ability you have to read minds," because they believe in
      that kind of stuff, "so I'll use it..." I was trained in Ericsonian
      stuff, "...to obtain for me the erasure code of all Omega programs. When
      you've done so, I want the yes-finger to float up." Then I ask them to
      tell it to me. "Are there backups for Omega programs?" "Yes." "Okay? How
      many backups are there?" "Six," they say, let's say. It's different
      numbers. "Is there an erasure code for all the backup programs?" "No."
      "Is there an erasure code that combines all the backups into one?"
      "Yes." "Obtain that code for me and when you've go it give me the yes-
      signal again." It can move almost that fast in some cases where there's
      not massive resistance.  Question?

Q: Yes, can you tell me what you know about the risks to the therapist?
   [Laughter]

Dr.H: You would have to ask.

Q: Yeah, I'd like to know that. What kind of data do you have given that
   you've had contact with large numbers of people. Not just threats but also
   any injury, any family problems that have arisen. That's one question. A
   second one is are you aware of anybody that you've treated -- or others --
   with this level of dissociation and trauma that have recovered? Integrated?
   Whole and happy?

Dr.H: Okay, I have one non-bloodline multiple, complex multiple who had this
      kind of programming where they have a lot of access to the patient as
      neighbors and where the doctor, by the way, you'll find physicians
      heavily involved.  They've encouraged their own to go to medical school,
      to prescribe drugs to take care of their own, to get access to medical
      technology and be above suspicion.  There have been a couple, in fact,
      in Utah who've been nailed now. We now in Utah have two full time
      ritual-abuse investigators with statewide jurisdiction under the
      Attorney General's Office to do nothing but investigate this. [Applause]

      Okay? In a poll done in the State of Utah in January by the major
      newspaper and television station, they found that ninety percent of
      Utahans believe that ritual abuse is genuine and real. Not all of them
      believe it's a frequent occurrence but some of that was imparted from
      two years of work by the Governor Commission on Ritual Abuse,
      interviewing, talking, meeting people, gathering data. Now when people
      say, by the way, "There's no evidence. They've never found a body,"
      that's baloney. They found a body in Idaho of a child.  They've had a
      case last summer that was convicted on first-degree murder charges, two
      people that the summer before that were arrested where the teenaged
      girl's finger and head were in the refrigerator and they were convicted
      of first-degree murder in Detroit. There have been cases and bodies.
      Back to risk.  I know of no therapist who's been harmed. But patients
      inform us that there will come a future time where we could be at risk
      of being assassinated by patients who've been programmed to kill at a
      certain time anyone that they've told and any member of their own family
      who's not active. If that would come about is speculative. Who knows for
      sure? Maybe, but I don't think it's entirely without risk.  A question
      in the back?

Q: It seems to me that there seems to be some similarity between these kinds
   of programming and those people who claim that they've been abducted by
   spaceships and have had themselves physically probed and reprogrammed and
   all of that sort of thing. Since Cape Canaveral is across the Florida
   peninsula from me and I don't think that they've reported any spaceships
   lately, I was just wondering is there any sort of relationship between this
   and that?

Dr.H: I'll share my speculation, that comes from others really. I've not dealt
      with any of those people. However, I know a therapist that I know and
      trust and respect who I've informed about all this a couple of years ago
      and has found it in a lot of patients and so on, who is firmly of the
      belief that those people are in fact ritual-abuse victims who have been
      programmed with that sort of thing to destroy all their credibility. If
      somebody's coming in and reporting abduction by a flying sauce who's
      going to believe them on anything else in the future? Also as a kind of
      thing that can be pointed to and said, "This is as ridiculous as that."
      All I know is that I recently had a consult, a telephone consult, with a
      therapist where I had been instructing her about some of this kind of
      stuff. When we were consulting at one point in the fifth or sixth
      interview she said, "By the way, do you know anything about this topic?"
      I said, "Well, not really" and shared with her what I shared with you. I
      said, "If it were me being with this guy..." that she'd been seeing for
      a couple of months, I said, "I would ask inside for the core to take
      control of finger-signals and inquire about Alpha, Beta, Delta, Theta."
      She proceeded to do all that, got back to me a week later and said,
      "Boy, were you on target. There is a part inside named Dr. Green.
      There's this kind of programming." Yes?
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