641 lines
40 KiB
Plaintext
641 lines
40 KiB
Plaintext
LIST
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FILE ON
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MARGIN IS 76
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STATUS: ENTER ONLY
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NUMBER OF LINES: 629
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1 If you are in need of help, you need but ask....
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2 ********************** REMOVED: 5 APR 84 *******************
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3 Welcome to BWMS (BackWater Message System) Mike Day System operator
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4 ************************************************************
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5 GENERAL DISCLAIMER: BWMS IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INFORMATION
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6 PLACED ON THIS SYSTEM.
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7 BWMS was created as an electronic bill board. BWMS is a privatly owned
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8 and operated system which is currently open for use by the general public.
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9 No restrictions are placed on the use of the system. As the system is
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10 privatly owned, I retain the right to remove any and all messages which
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11 I may find offensive. Because of the limited size of the system, it will be
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12 periodically purged of messages. (only 629 lines of data can be saved)
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13 To leave a message, type 'ENTER' and use ctrl/C or break to get out of the
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14 ENTER mode. The message is automatically stored. If after entering the
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15 message you find you made a mistake, use the replace command to replace
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16 the line. To exit from the system, type 'OFF' then hang up.
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17 Type 'HELP' to see other commands that are available on the system.
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18 ************************************************************
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19
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20 OscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscar
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21 The dinner of rabit that the cat whom I seemed to have befriended
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22 somehow, was good and filled my empty stomach.
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23 But now, the hot scortching sun that had beaten down all day was
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24 gone, and the chill night was once more creaping in. Warming my hands
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25 over the crackling fire, I sit and wonder what to do next. My search
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26 so far has been a total bust. Beyond finding a possible clue back at
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27 the streem, I have not found a trace of PAM since. With the coming
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28 of darkness so matched my mood.
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29 Absentmindedly scratching the ears of the great cat, I look out
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30 at the clouds beginning to form covering the two moons crossing the
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31 night sky. "It looks like we are in for a storm, eh Green Eyes? I
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32 think that we best find some high ground just in case."
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33 That grove of trees looks like it is a bit higher then the rest
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34 of this, so it will probably do.
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35 Soon the clouds break loose their heavy load in a tremendous
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36 downpour. Retreating to the shelter of the tent to wait out the
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37 storm, I gaze out through the tent flap at the ragging elements
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38 without as it tears at the land making rivlets of mud tearing small
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39 clumps of grass and small stones loose.
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40 Soon the small depression that I had encamped in was a rushing
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41 torrent of water and mud. I was very glad indeed that I had decided
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42 to move out before the rains came.
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43 Seeing that I was safe for the time being, I lay down to get some
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44 sleep wondering if I would ever find PAM and the way back home.
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45 OscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscarOscar
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46
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47 ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
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48 SOMEONE MENTIONED CRIME BEING BASICALLY UNEFFECTED WHERE STRICT GUN CON-
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49 TROL IS ENFORCED. THE REASON FOR THIS IS GUNS HAVE BEEN PROLIFIC FOR
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50 YEARS. ANYTIME SOMETHING BECOMES CONTROLED OR ILLEGAL, YOU CAN BET
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51 THERE'S A WHOLE LOT OF IT ALREADY AROUND.
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52 ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?DEBORAH?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
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53 ########################################WEell, I see the same stupid
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54 a2guments are still out there against Gun control!!!!
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55 Will someone give me one good reason for anyone to own any kind of firearm?
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56 If 'guns were no longer available to the public then they wouldn't be
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57 available to the criminal, as 99.99% of all guns used in crime are either
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58 Saturday night specials or stolen from "re3pectable" citizens.
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59 The crimes ofp passion an$ the needless slaughter of our children through
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60 accidental usage of guns would cease if we had strong National gun control
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61 laws and even stronger enforcement. A3 for you so called "Sportsmen" out
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62 there, why don' you grow up!! As long as we have supermarkets, Farms, &
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63 ranches there is noneed for firearms, Ju3st plain old money.........
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64 ##C.Y.M.#######################4/2/84 9:18 am###############################
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65 Zipster & Hawthorne:Hey guys! This system uses up the *SAME* amount of
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66 space for each line you enter. Be it 1 character or 80, it still uses up a
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67 sector on the disk. Since there are only 629 free sectors (- 18 for Mikey's
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68 header) would you please try to use longer lines? The system will let you
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69 know when you reach the end of the line. It will quit echoing your
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70 characters back, so if you are in the middle of a word & it won't let you
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71 enter the rest of it, just backspace erase the partial word, hit return &
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72 continue on the new line. OK? Thanks.
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73
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74 Deborah, I believe he was EXCLUDING war casualties in that comparison of
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75 high school sport deaths & gun deaths. We ARE talking about CIVILIAN gun
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76 control, after all.
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77 CYM:I hate to tell you this but those farms & ranches USE GUNS! (GASP!)
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78 We used a rifle to kill the animals we slaughtered for our own consumption.
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79 And while we did set traps, we also needed rifles for shooting coyotes when
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80 they went after the sheep. (I know, many farmers & ranchers exaggerate the
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81 amount of damage done to their stock by predators. BUT IT STILL HAPPENS!!)
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82 (Matter of fact, feral dogs are becoming a problem in some areas!)
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83 As for hunters, I've never been hunting, but I know people who have.
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84 THEY used the meat, hide & antlers of the deer they shot. I admit that this
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85 is not what many hunters do, but I consider the fools who go out there and
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86 don't USE what they shoot to be BUTCHERS (at best).
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87 There is also the often overlooked point that in many (not all)
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88 hunting areas, if the hunters don't kill the deer (or elk, or moose, or...)
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89 many more would die of starvation! Back east (in Maine, I believe) exactly
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90 that happen when "conservationists" & "ecologists" stopped the annual moose
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91 season.After starvation weakened the herds, disease killed over 50% of them
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92
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93 Someone else mentioned the difficulty of stopping the production
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94 of guns. Well, he understated the case considerable! Most street punks in
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95 New York (or most other large cities) can tell you how to make a handgun out
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96 of things that I rather doubt you would care to outlaw! (I will NOT give
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97 details, as we have too many mental midgets that would build them if I
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98 told them how!) As an example, would you care to try banning:
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99 Matches, marbles, ball bearings, & ALL metal tubing under .25 inch?
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100 (there are many more items, but I think you get the drift)
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101 Oh, by the way, homemade guns have been made in PRISON! I somehow doubt that
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102 we can exercise that much control over the general public, and even if
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103 we could you can see that it won't help!
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104 _________________________________Leonard____________________________________
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105 Okay, here it is.......
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106 The summer of 1787 was long and hot, especially for the delegates
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107 to the constitutional convention in Philidelphia. The country had been
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108 run for nearly ten years under the Articles of Confederation, and it
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109 wasn't working. The states had too much power and the country was
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110 divided into the states' own fifedoms. The handfull of men in Phila-
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111 delphia had to write a comprehensive document, rigid enough to maintain
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112 order, yet flexible enough to withstand the test of time. On top of
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113 that they had to appease the individual wants of different states.
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114 So the main body of the constitution was puposefully ambiguous.
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115 And when the bill of rights was tacked on, it was writen in the same
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116 manner. This allowed the interpretation of the constitution to change
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117 with the times. For this reason the constitution cannot be literally
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118 interpreted! In my text I was merely joking. When taken literally
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119 the constitution means very little. Instead, the "Supreme law of the
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120 land" is what the courts interpret the constitution as saying. This
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121 is what Madison, Hamilton, et. al. intended, as is evidenced by the
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122 Federalist
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123 (oops) Papers.
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124 You also claim that the constitution states that "If something is
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125 not indicated within the constitution, that does not mean that it is
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126 allowed, but rather the opposite." I ask where? Could you be refering
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127 to the Tenth Amendment? It reads as follows "The powers not delegated
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128 to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the
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129 States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
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130 In a very narrow literal sense this could be applicable, but I hardly
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131 think that was the intent of the amendment. It emphasizes a federal
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132 system, and that topic could fill the rest of the disk!
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133 Shifting gears to the present, What should I see at breakfast
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134 this morning? That singer Marvin Gaye was shot with a .38 caliber
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135 pistol in an argument over insurance WITH HIS FATHER. I could make
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136 several very tasteless remarks about the man killing in self defense,
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137 but I'll hold back. If his father had only had a knife would things
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138 have been different? It would be difficult for a father to stab his
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139 son to death, but in the heat of passion a handgun is too easy. Just
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140 point and pull. Ask Marvins father what he thinks about hand guns
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141 now. But no matter, us soft-headed liberals just don't know what the
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142 world is really like. Yup, It's a mans world out there, and its either
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143 kill or be killed.
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144 Mr. Tim
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145 Addenum : In my first quote I left out a "not", and it changed the
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146 context of the quote, i.e. I discovered what ENTER ONLY
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147 Means. Not complaining, mind you.
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148 ############################################################################
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149 off
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150 off
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151 ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
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152 Well,it seems that I xave sliped a few disks somehow,enter only is obveously
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153 new.we have a few new people,there is no story line to contribute to.
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154 I am DEPRESSED about this!!
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155 C.Y.M.:when I was a metal shop student in high school(not long ago) I made
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156 several weapons that would kill a person very efficently,2 were guns.the
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157 construction plans for them were incredibly easy to get,a radical book
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158 store in downtown portland carrys them.I might add that when I am downtown I
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159 usualy carry some type of weapon (not the guns) and have had to use it
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160 more then once.
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161 The Man in Gray
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162 ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
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163 WELL FOLKS, LET'S TRY IT AGAIN! I'M TRULY SORRYABOUT THOSE NASTY LITTLE
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164 ESCAPE SEQUENCES. THE TERMINAL I USE AT MY WORK REALITY WAS GIVING ME
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165
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166 TROUBLES FOR SOME REASON I STILL HAVEN'T FATHOMED. I'VE SWITCHED OVER
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167 THOUGH
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168 I AM EXPERIENCING ONE MINOR DIFFICULTY- WHEN I HIT THE SPACE BAR
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169
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(AND I MEAN THAT FIGUREATIVLY) THE SYSTEM JUMPS OUT OF THE
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170 ENTER STATE AND GO TO THE REA STATE. AM I DOING SOMETHING TO
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171 CAU E THIS? I'M STILL NEW AT THIS AND I REALLY DON'T WANT TO MUSS
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172 U P ANYTHING. IS IT POSSIBLE MY MODEM IS THE PROBLEM? AS FOR THE GUN
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173 CONTROL DEBATE I SAID MY PIECE LAST WEEK. SEE YOU ALL LATER.
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174 F. FIN
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175 """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
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176 *****************************************************************
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177 MR.TIM: I SEE THAT YOU HAVE DISCOVERED THE HORRIBLE TRUTH ABOUT
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178 THE CONSTITUTION. THAT BEING THAT IT IS WRITTEN SUCH THAT ANYONE
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179 CAN INTERPERT IT TO FIT WHATEVER THEY WANT. ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS
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180 READ IT FOR A BIT, AND YOU WILL FIND A PASSAGE THAT WILL FIT WHAT
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181 EVER YOUR FAVORITE PERSUATION IS. JUST LIKE A BIBLE. FOR THE
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182 CONSTITUTION IS THE BIBLE OF THE UNITED STATES. AND LIKE A BIBLE,
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183 IT IS USED BY WHOEVER WIELDS IT TO SUPPORT THEIR CLIAMS AS THE
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184 ONLY TRUE INTERPERTATION. THIS IS NOT TO SAY THAT IT IS A
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185 WORTHLESS PEICE OF PAPER, FAR BE FROM IT! IT IS THE VERY
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186 FOUNDATION UPON WHICH WE HAVE FORMED THIS NATION. BUT WE MUST
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187 REMEMBER THAT IT IS THE FOUNDATION, AND NOT THE SUPERSTUCTURE.
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188 ********************* CISTOP MIKEY ****************************
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189 !#!@$#$%$^%&*^&(&*)*()*^%&^#$%^#^^$%^#$%^$%^$#^$^$^$%^$&%^&&%*%*#^$#^$
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190 WARNING NOTICE TO ALL DEMOCRATES AND OTHERS WHO CARE...
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191 In the preceeding messages we have all read quite a bit of material on
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192 the interpretation of the consitution. Some people don't realize it,
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193 but the one branch of government that does the interpretation is the
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194 Supreme Court. Not the President, and not Congress. The Supreme court
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195 and its relation with the Constitution give it its balancing power with
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196 the other two branches. Most people do know that Supreme court positions
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197 are appointed, and are appointed for life. THESE are not elected by
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198 popular vote, nor is there any ratifying process by Congress. These
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199 positions of great importance to our country are appointed by the president.
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200 The President we 'elect' but none the less the choice, if he has a need
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201 to, is in this one man's hands. Do people realize just how important
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202 this selection process is? Do people realize that if the current adminis-
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203 tration is re-elected, it will probably have the oppurtunity to appoint
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204 TWO MORE MEMBERS to the most powerful and influential court in the land!
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205 A court that when loaded with the right, interpret the consitution quite
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206 differently from when it is loaded with the not-so-right (I just could't
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207 use the word "left"). When anyone starts mass-quoting the constitution,
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208 they always seem to forget(a few have remembered here though) that it
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209 is not so much what the consitution reads but how it is read. A very
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210 careful distinction must be made here. A national gun control law is
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211 not likely given the makeup of the current supreme court, where no
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212 doubt such a case would surely end up. It is important to remember
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213 our series of checks and balances, and how, at the present time, the
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214 leadership of this country is in such a state that liberal ideas such
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215 as gun control, no matter how much sense it makes, don't have much
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216 of a chance getting through. All one has to do is look at the amount of
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217 de-control that is happening. The airlines, the oil companies, the
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218 auto makers are all thanking (well most of the airlines I should add)
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219 the administration for its hands off, let industry do as it thinks
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220 best attitude. Also, don't forget the power of lobbies. The NRA is
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221 one of the most powerful lobbies in Washington. Our own governer is
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222 a member of the NRA, and has appeared in ads for them. This latest
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223 teflon bullet debate hasn't helped their image much, but knowing the
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224 NRA, they will certainly survive, and bounce back stronger than
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225 ever. There...my political statements, and this session of poly-sci
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226 101 is over. No doubt my ears will be burning before too long, but hey,
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227 that's what the backwater is all about. No one talkes about relevant
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228 issues such as gun control on CBBS right?
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229 #@$!@#$#@$%#% L'homme sans parity $#%#$%*#$%*#$^#@^^%^#$^#^$%&$%&$%&$%&#
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230
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231 AND WHERE ELSE COULD YOU PRESENT YOUR VIEWS WITHOUT GETTING A PUNCH`
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232 IN THE FACE RIGHT?
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233 ---------------------------------------------------------
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234 XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX AS FOR GUN CONTROL I SAY THAT A LAW
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235 SHOULD BE MADE THAT WOULD EITHER MAKE SURE
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236 OWNERS OF GUNS KNEW HOW TO USE THEM PROPERLY
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237 SO NO ACCIDENTS WERE PEOPLE COULD GET HURT
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238 COULD HAPPEN,AND RESTRICTING ALL PEOPLE WITH A CRIMINAL RECORD TO OWN A GUN
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239 OR A LAW THAT WOULD OUTLAW GUNS UTTERLY EXCEPT TO PEOPLE WHO USE THEM
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240 FOR THEIR BUSINESSES(FARMERS,GUARDS ETC)
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241 THIS WOULD CONTROL GUNS TO A POINT I THINK,BUT GUNS CAN BE SMUGGLED IN SO I
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242 THINK OTHER MEASURES SHOULD BE TAKEN TO PREVENT ARMED ROBBERY SUCH AS GUARDS
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243 OR MORE AND BETTER ALARM SYSTEMSTHOUTHE LATTER WOULD BE TAKEN IN AN EXTREME
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244 PRO,I THINK THE FORMER WOULD BE SUFFICIENT
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245
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246 PHERIC
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247 CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCWHAT IS THE MATTER WITH THE SYSTEM,I CANNOT
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248
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249 REPLACE ANYTHING
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250
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251 PLEASE RESPOND!!!
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252 ZZZXZXZXZXZXZXZXXZXZXXZXZXZXZXZX
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253 ****************************************************************************
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254 SORRY ABOUT THAT BUT THIS MODEM SOFTWARE DOESNT ALLOW ME TO CHANGE
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255 THE LINE LENGTH.SORRY.
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256 THINK THAT THE PREVIOUS INFORMATION ON THE SUPREMEM COURT BEING THE
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257 SUPREME COUT WAS WRONG.WE ELCET THOSE PEOPLY WHO STAND FOR WHAT WE BELEIVE
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258 IN ON ALL ISSUES IT DOESNT ALWAWORKS .USUALLY
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259 NOT ALLWAYS BUT IT HAS IT'S MOMENTS.LOBBYING GROUPS INSTEAD OF VOTING TRY
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260 TO CHANGE OUR SENATORS,AND REPRESENTATIVES MINDS.BASICALLY
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261 THEY ARE JUST GLORIFIED AD-MEN. BUT IF WE VOTE FOR THE STRONG MIND,AND THOSE
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262 WITH FIRM CONVICTIONS WE MOST LIKELY WILL GET WHAT WE WANT. AND THAT IS A
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263 LEGAL SYSTEM WITH LAWS WE WANT. THAT'S THE IDEA.SO IN A SENSE WE HAVE A
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264 MAJOR PART TO DO WITH THE SUPREME COURT!NOT REMOVED FROM US AS IT SOUNDED
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265 EDRLIER IS IT?
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266 WHATI MEANT EARLIER ABOUT THE DIFFICULTY OF MAKING GUNS IS THE
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267 HIGH LEVEL OF DIFFICULTY OF MAKING GOOD,QUALITY DESIGNS.THAT IS WHY I HAD
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268 THOSE FIVE WORDS IN THERE ANYWAY REMBER?'GUNS,RIFLES,ET CETRA'.KINDA FORGOT
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269 IT HUH?I DIDN'T MEEN LITTLE CANNONS OR PELLET TUBES I MEANT
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270 THE BIG MEAN SATURDAY NIGHT SPECIALS THAT ARE SO EASY TO GET ,AND HAVE BEEN
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271 SINCE BEFORE THE YEAR 1971.LIKE
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272 I SAID THOSE BIG ONEHARD
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273 TO PRODUCE BUT EASY TO DISTRIBUTE. I WANT SOMEONE TO CITE A MODERN EXAMPLE
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274 OFEFFECTIVE GUN CONTROL.
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275 ********************************************************HAWTHORNE***********
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276 One small note on the Supreme Court:
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277 The presidents choices are reviewed by the senate, and in theory
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278 congress can impeach and do several other things to intimidate
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279 justices, but as a rule the presidents appointments are accepted and
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280 the court has a free reign. So there is definately a valid fear
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281 of Ronnie giving us two more justices and really leaving his mark on
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282 American politics. Please do not take offense, I am just clarifying
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283 your point.
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284 Mr. Tim
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285
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286 :************************************************************:
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287
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288 Enough is enough. You gun control advocates have been duped by
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289 anti-capitalist forces that hve taken control of the American
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290 mass media. Have any of you ever been shot at? Do any of you
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291 know anyone who has been killed by a handgun? Of course not,
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292 because nobody has been.
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293
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294 There is no danger from handguns...or any other kind of lethal
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295 weopon. The whole anti-gun hysteria is being cr
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296 the liberals who control the press. If so many people are
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297 being killed by handguns why don't any of you know any of
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298 them? Because no one is being killed, that's why. You're all
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299 being lied to by enemies of the tactical weopons industry.
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300
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301 Guns, in the hands of responsible, patriotic, Americans, are
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302 what has made this nation what it is. I offer my own success
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303 in life as testimony of how gun toting Americans have made
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304 this nation great.
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305
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306 LeRoy McKane
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307
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308 :**********************************************************:
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309 MIKEY: I CAN CERTAINLY APPRECIATE WHY YOU CHANGED THE SYSTEM
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310 SO THAT NO CHANGES ARE ALLOWED. I KNOW I'VE BEEN FRUSTR
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311 WHEN PEOPLE HAVE MESSED WITH MY ENTRIES. I, TOO, WAS PISSED
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312 OFF WHEN SOME CLOWN DELETED THAT DISC. BUT NOT BEING ABLE TO
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313 EDIT, REVISE, OR CHANGE MY THOUGHTS IS A REAL FRUSTRATION. I
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314 DON'T KNOW HOW OTHERS FEEL, BUT I WOULD PREFER THE RISK OF
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315 VANDALISM TO THE FRUSTRATION OF NOT BEING ABLE TO POLISH MY
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316 WORK. IT'S YOUR SYSTEM, AND YOU OBVIOUSLY HAVE THE RIGHT TO
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317 RUN IT ANY WAY YOU WANT, BUT I WOULD HOPE YOU WILL RECONSIDER
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318 THIS EDITORIAL POLICY. GARY
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319 *************************************************************
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320 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
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321 LIKE HAWTHORNE SAID IT IS ALL CONTROLLED BY CHECKS AND BALLANCES.THAT IS THE
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322 IDEA.NO SINGLE PART OF THE WHOLE HAS CONTROLLING POWER OVER THE OTHERS.SO IF
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323 ANY ONE OF THE THREE SECTIONS OF GOVERNMENT TRIES THEY CANNOT BETHE SOLE
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324 BASE OF POWER.
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325 BY THE WAY THE THREE SECTIONS ARE SOMETHING LIKE CONGRESS,EXECUTIVE AND LEG-
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326 AL.
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327 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ZZZZZZZZZZIPSTER+++++++++++
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328
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329
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330 THE ONLY PURPOSE OF GUN CONTROL LAWS WOULD BE TO FURTHER PAD THE POCKETS OF
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331 ATTORNEYS AND OR LAWYERS! TO BAD BUT WE PRODUCE MORE LAWS THAN CAN BE
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332 ENFORCED AND SPEND MORE MONEY KEEPING CRIMINALS OUT OF JAIL THAN WHAT WE
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333 SPEND ON JAIL SPACE TO KEEP THEM IN. INSTEAD OF GUN CONTROL LETS HAVE
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334 ATTORNEY CONTROL LAWS.
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335 AFTER ALL LOOK AT ALL THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN MURDERED BY ATTORNEYS.!!
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336 GEORGE LURKER
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337 ****************************************************************************
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338 The last I heard Oregon was talking about putting the state laws on a
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339 computer, and allowing anybody with a modem to dial in and acess it. But
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340 the lawyers were fighting the idea, saying that easy acces to the laws
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341 was too dangerous, only a lawyer could understand the law. [Or should we
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342 say that they fear losing thier jobs because we might see how useless they
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343 are?] Has anyone heard more of this project?
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344
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345 Enter only is a nusiance, but I am willing to put up with it for a while.
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346 ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::I THINK GUN CONTROL SHOULD BE BANNED AND
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347 THE CONSTITUTION SHOULD BE BURNED!AND IF PEOPLE WANT TO BUILD HOMEMADE GUNS
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348 OUT OF PIPE AND WOOD AND MATCHES THEN LET THEM THEY WILL ONLY BLOW THEIR FAC
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349 ES OFF IN THE END!!
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350 We don't need gun control, just LeRoy control
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351 Mr. Tim
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352 -----------------------------------------------------------------------
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353 To: Michael Bigham
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354 Where is my beer?
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355 Adrienne
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356 ?????????????????????????
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357 **********************************************************
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358 GEORGE LURKER: I GOT A BETTER IDEA, LETS GIVE ALL THE LAWYERS THEIR VERY
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359 OWN HANDGUNS ALL LOADED AND READY TO GO AND LET THEM KILL THEMSELVES
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360 ALL OFF! I ALSO THINK THAT ANY GOVERNMENT OFFICIAL WHO HAS A DECISION
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361 IN MAKING WAR MUST BE REQUIRED TO SERVE AS MUCH TIME ON THE FRONT LINES
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362 IN THE TRENCHES AS ANY OTHER SOLDIER. I'VE GOT A FEELING THAT THEY MIGHT
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363 THINK TWICE BEFORE DOING SOMETHING DRASTIC.
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364 ************************ CISTOP MIKEY ******************************
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365 I'm in favor of gun control. Any idiot can kill someone with a gun, but it takes skill & practice to kill with a
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366 garotte, shurikin, yawara or even a sword. Let's get rid of the guns and then I can live like a king!
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367 Gaius
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368 && && &&
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369 Mikey, I seldom see any pressing need to go back over my messages, but the ENTER ONLY mode seems to be causing some
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370 of us more grief than it's worth. I hope we can get back to normal soon so the Backwater can become (semi-)legible
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371 again.
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372 && The Mad Actor &&
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373 ************************************************************************************************************************
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374
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375 TO THE WORLD:I MAKE THIS CONFESSION FROM MY HEART.\
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376 THIS IS HARD FOR ME,BUT I FEEL THAT I MUST TELL THE WORLD IN ORDER
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377 THAT I MAY LIVE IN PEACE WITH MYSELF.
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378 THIS IS IT:
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379 I AM GAY.
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380 DO YOU HEAR THAT WORLD?
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381
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382
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383 I AM GAY!!!!
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384
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385 THERE, NOW I FEEL AS IF I MAY LIVE WITH MYSELF NOW.
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386 I THINK THAT IT IS BETER THAT ALL PEOPLE BE MORE OPEN WITH EACH OTHER AND
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387 NOT HIDE ANY SECRETS.
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388 I URGE ALL OF YOU OUT THERE TO NOT HIDE ANY LONGER YOUR DEEP DARK SECRETS.
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389 IT FEELS SO GOOD NOT TO BE IN THE CLOSET ANY MORE.
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390 I AM FREE!
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391
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392 SINCERILY YOURS
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393 DENNIS LESLIE
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394
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395
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396 *******************************************************************************
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397
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398
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399
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400 AW, SHOOT. I WAS HOPING RIGHT UP UNTIL THE END OF THE ABOVE THAT IT WAS FROM FRANK IVANCIE. OH, WELL...
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401 !|!|!|!|!|!|!|!|!|___THE SILVER GHOST___!|!|!|!|!|!|!|!|!
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402 8888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888
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403 I CAN SEE NO WAY TO GET RID OF GUNS IN THE HANDS OF THOSE WHO WANT THEM.DOES
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404 ANYONE OUT THERE AGREE WITH WHAT I THINK HEINLIEN WAS SAYING ABOUT AN ARMED POP-ULACE CONTRIBUTING TO MANNERS AND
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405 SELFRELIANCE. I'M NOT MUCH INTO THE MACHO THING BUT I DO BELIEVE THAT KNOWING THAT
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406 YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR YOUR OWN LIFE WOULD CONTRIBUTE TO A POLITER AND MORE
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407 SELF ASSURED SOCIETY. I'M ALSO SURE THAT ANY BURGLAR OR CRIMANAL THAT KNEW HE
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408 COULD EXPECT TO GET SHOT ANYWHERE HE ATTEMPTED TO COMMIT A CRIME MIGHT HAVE
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409 SECOND THOUGHTS. AS IT IS NOW IF YOU DON'T KILL THEM IN THE ACT OF BREAKING
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410 INTO YOUR HOUSE OR SOMETHING OF THAT NATURE YOU CAN EXPECT TO GO TO PRISON
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411 YOURSELF. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE A LITTLE LESS ABOUT THE RIGHTS OF CRIMINALS
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412 AND A LITTLE MORE ABOUT THE RIGHTS OF VICTIMS.
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413 THIS LETTER SEEMS A LITTLE CONFUSED
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414 BUT ITS 3:00 AND I'M TIRED
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415 STEVE
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416 8888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888
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417 Well now, there seems to be some debate about guns out there
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418 I ask you, HOW repressive can our government get if there were no guns?
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419 All those gun banners out there please decide whether you want a ban on guns or not
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420 If you do, then move to U.S.S.R.. There, ALL guns are banned( unless you belong to the army)
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421 As long as there are weapons in the general public the government will never resort to martial law, because if it does,
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422 it will be overthrown!
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423
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424 ppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppp
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425 Aaaron -- seems as if you have enough ammunition being discharged on your
|
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426 side of the gun control debate. I'm abandoning ship and leaving back to my
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427 original side. (and I think it's time to restate my case)
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428 1. No restrictions should be placed upon the ownership, of weapons.
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429 This includes firearms, ammunition, parts and supplies.
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430 2. Each and every person -- with no exeption must complete a course in
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431 safety, maintenance, handling and using firearms; then shoot a qualifying
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432 score with rifle and pistol on a target range.
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433 There! The liberals should be mad at me because I favor no gun control, the
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434 conservatives because (if they're consistent) I advocate another law regulating
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435 the schools. Now let's look at why.
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436 Accidents happen. Most accidents happen through ignorance. Most of the
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437 city folk (and most americans are city folk) have not handled firearms and
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438 have not had any training in doing so. The exeptions, of course, are those
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439 who have had military training. This vast pool of ignorant people regard
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440 firearms with fear and loathing. They want to play the ostrich game -- ban
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441 these nasty things and they will go away. Sorry, folks, they won't go away.
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442 Firearms are not difficult to make in a home shop. (Good firearms are a
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443 result of skill and patience. The british tried to ban firearms to the natives
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444 when they controlled Afganistan. The natives tore up iron rails from the
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445 railways, bored holes lengthwise, filed down the rail to barrel size and
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446 fitted firing mechanisms from still other stolen rails and killed many, many
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447 british soldiers with them.) Ammunition is also quite easy to make. However,
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448 these homemade cannons are likely to be less reliable on the average than
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449 commercially manufactured goods. Should gun control advocates suceed in
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450 banning legal ownership of firearms, the age and condition of the vast pool
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451 of firearms would deteriorate. I feel that this would lead to more danger as
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452 I feel more threatened by a gun in poor condition than one in good condition.
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453 Everyone should know how a gun feels when it is fired, what it can and cannot
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454 do, how to use and maintain it. A gun is a tool. It's purpose is to kill.
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455 We need to realize that it is a final solution, and that ultimately we cannot
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456 undo the use of a gun. We also need to know how to use one if necessary.
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457 ppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppp
|
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458 ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!\
|
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459 I HAVEN'T THOUGHT ABOUT GUNS FOR QUITE SOME TIME TILL THIS DEBATE BEGAN.
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460 BUT YESTERDAY WHILE PRACTICING ONE OF MY FAVORITE PASTIMES, DAYDREAMING,
|
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461 I CAME UP WITH A SOLUTION! IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN, BUT I WOULD ENJOY IT IF
|
|
462 IT DID.
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463 SEE WHAT THEY COULD DO IS DIVIDE THE WORLD IN HALF WITH SOMETHING LIKE
|
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464 A CHINA WALL. ONE SIDE WOULD ALLOW FIREARMS, THE OTHER WOULDN'T! NO ONE
|
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465 WOULD BE FORCED TO LIVE IN EITHER ONE, ALL COULD PICK WHICH THEY PREFER-
|
|
466 ED. THE WALL WOULD HAVE DISENTEGRATER CAPABILITIES, NOT FOR HUMANS, BUT
|
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467 FOR FIREARMS, SO THAT NONE COULD PASS THROUGH. ALSO ANYONE ATTEMPTING TO
|
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468 CREATE A FIREARM ON THE WRONG SIDE WOULD BE IMMEDIATELY TRANSFERED TO THE
|
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469 PROPER SIDE.
|
|
470 THEN WHEN I FELT LIKE A STEAK, DEER OF COURSE, I WOULD HAVE TO OUTWIT
|
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471 THE ANIMAL. AT LEAST IT WOULD HAVE HALF A CHANCE, AND THERE WOULD BE A
|
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472 GREATER CHANCE FOR THE SRONGER, SMARTER ANIMALS TO SURVIVE. I WOULDN'T
|
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473 NEED TO WORRY ABOUT ME OR MY FAMILY BEING ACCIDENTLY SHOT ANYWAY. THERE'S
|
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474 ENOUGH WAYS OUT THERE ALREADY. AND WHY NOT PUT ALL THE CARS ON ONE SIDE
|
|
475 ALSO.....AND NUCLEAR BOMBS............PEOPLE WITH UNCONTROLED VIOLENT
|
|
476 TENDENCIES............HEY!........I THINK I MAY BE ON TO SOMETHING
|
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477 HERE!
|
|
478 PIPER: WHERE IN THE WORLD DOWNTOWN DO YOU GO? I'VE SPENT HOURS AND DAYS
|
|
479 DOWNTOWN AND HAVE NEVER FELT THE NEED FOR A WEAPON. I ADMIT THAT CITY
|
|
480 LIVING IS VERY NEW FOR ME, AM I MISSING SOMETHING? I WOULD IMAGINE
|
|
481 I'M A BIT NAIVE IN THIS REGARD.........SHOULD I CHANGE MY LACADAISICAL
|
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482 WAYS?
|
|
483 ?!?!?!?!?!?!??!!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!DEBORAH?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
|
|
484 P.S SORRY PIPER, I MEANT TO ADDRESS THE MAN IN GRAY! NOT BEING ABLE TO
|
|
485 MAKE CORRECTIONS THO IS A GOOD TRADE FOR VANDALISM. GOOD IDEA MIKEY!
|
|
486 ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
|
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487 ########################################YOU ALL MISSED MY POINT! I SAID
|
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488 THAT WITH THE GUN CONTROL LAWS WE ALSO NEED STRICTLY ENFORCED LAWS. Any one
|
|
489 caught with an unregistered firearm or
|
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490 using one in a criminal act would face the strictest of convictions, no plea
|
|
491 bargaining allowed, only time with no parole allowed. I have the feeling
|
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492 that if this were implemented we would see a vast reduction in the criminal
|
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493 statistics and the need for new prison space. As a mater of fact we could
|
|
494 use the no parole bit right now and also do away with plea bargaining.
|
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495 ##############C.Y.M.#############################4/3/84 8:54am##############
|
|
496
|
|
497 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
|
|
498 SOMEONE MENTIONED EARLIER ABOUT PROFESSIONAL THIEVES
|
|
499 AND GUNS. THEY ARE ONE GROUP OF PEOPLE WHO WOULD
|
|
500 DEARLY LOVE TO SEE GUNS BANNED. IF THERE IS ONE THING
|
|
501 THEY FEAR MORE THEN ANYTHING ELSE IN THEIR LINE OF
|
|
502 WORK, IT'S SOME CRAZY HOUSE OWNER WITH A GUN. THEY
|
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503 HAVE A TENDANCY TO SHOOT FIRST AND ASK QUESTIONS
|
|
504 LATER. FEW HAVE EVER FIRED A GUN BEFORE, AND HAVE
|
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505 NO IDEA WHAT THE THING IS ALL ABOUT. MANY DON'T
|
|
506 EVEN REALIZE THAT IT CAN KILL UNTIL IT IS TOO LATE.
|
|
507 QUESTION, WHY IS IT WE HAVE LAWS THAT STATE THAT YOU
|
|
508 'MUST' KILL A PERSON IF YOU SHOOT HIM, OR YOU'RE
|
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509 GOING TO BE IN BIG TROUBLE?
|
|
510 +++++++++++++++++ REX ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
|
|
511 Piper:I have a few ideas that you have overlooked.
|
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512 1. The trouble isn't limited to people with guns misusing them.Contary to a
|
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513 statement made above, it does NOT require much skill to kill someone with a
|
|
514 sword, club or ax - IF the person you are attacking doesn't know much about
|
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515 their use either! Knives do take some skill, but you can still mess someone
|
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516 up pretty badly. So the REAL problem is NOT guns, knives, etc., it's AWDW
|
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517 (Assault with a Deadly Weapon) (should have been ADW above, sorry).
|
|
518 2. Too many people seem to think they can settle a dispute with force. They
|
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519 may eliminate the other party(s) in the dispute, but...
|
|
520 We need to find a way to teach people NOT to use force. If someone ATTACKS
|
|
521 you (PHYSICALLY, not VERBALLY!) you are justified in defending yourself.
|
|
522 (Note however, that it is almost ALWAYS possible to provoke an attack! This
|
|
523 needs to be discouraged too.)
|
|
524 3. Therefore, we need to have strict penalties for violent behavior. I am
|
|
525 not just talking about adult criminals either. We need to start with
|
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526 schoolyard bullies and work our way up.
|
|
527
|
|
528 Since I was one of the VICTIMS of schoolyard bullies etc, I may be somewhat
|
|
529 prejudiced. As for the Marvin Gaye incident, I don't give a DAMN about how
|
|
530 his father feels about guns! He had no business getting into a FIGHT
|
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531 (read the paper, "physical altercation" ie FIGHT) with ANYONE. & when
|
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532 he brings a weapon OF ANY KIND into it - he gets NO sympathy from me! The
|
|
533 whole object of a fight is to drive off, incapacitate, or kill your oppenent
|
|
534 Which you are trying to do depends on whether you are the attacker or the
|
|
535 attackee. If your opponent is unarmed and not a martial arts expert, you are
|
|
536 in no real danger. So if you go for a weapon, you had better know what you
|
|
537 are doing. (ie Have a VERY good reason, such as you stand 5'2" & weigh 100
|
|
538 pounds dripping wet and he looks like King Kong's standin) Otherwise YOU are
|
|
539 now the one ATTACKING!
|
|
540 I believe there is something like this in the law. I think it's
|
|
541 called "sufficient force" or something like that.
|
|
542 Finally, as an example of how weapons CAN be handled properly,
|
|
543 I offer the SCA. In the SCA, swords, maces, knives & the occasional pistol
|
|
544 are almost always at hand, yet they only get used for display or in REAL
|
|
545 emergencies. This is probably because we are ALL quite well aware of what
|
|
546 they can do & how they are used. I have seen ONCE seen someone reach for his
|
|
547 belt knife during an argument. In that case he was LOUDLY told to take his
|
|
548 hand of the knife. (not by the person he was arguing with, either!)
|
|
549 "Drawing steel" except for display, use as an eating utensil etc, is
|
|
550 ACTIVELY discouraged. If you cannot handle a weapon properly, you are told
|
|
551 to learn how or leave it at home. While we "play" with our wooden "mock-ups"
|
|
552 playing with the real thing is NOT done. Maybe this is what should be done
|
|
553 in the "real" world with ALL privately owned weapons. No more "BANG! you're
|
|
554 dead", instead take the kid out to the target range with a REAL gun. And
|
|
555 give him "what for" if he does anything with his toy gun that he shouldn't
|
|
556 do with the real thing. But we'll never get parents to go along with it.....
|
|
557 _______________________________Leonard______________________________________
|
|
558 The Portland Science Fiction Society (PorSFiS) is having a meeting at the
|
|
559 Multnomah County Library (downtown) at 2pm. The Doctor Who fan club meets
|
|
560 there at about 3 or 3:30. Many of the denizens of BWMS are frequenting these
|
|
561 meetings. (We talk during the break & after the meeting we go to
|
|
562 PC&S (the official PorSFiS pub)).
|
|
563 Everyone is invited (_especially_ the person who altered the
|
|
564 disks over the weekend). Several of us are rather identifiable:
|
|
565 MIG: wears all gray
|
|
566 BARD: carries a red cord (something about "Hairy Fishnuts"???)
|
|
567 the apprentice: has a PINK & PURPLE braid he has been known to use as a
|
|
568 headband (maybe he's color blind? that would explain Fast Freddie's
|
|
569 remodelling?)
|
|
570 Ian MacHinery: identifiable by thehis equipment (you expect the NETWORK rep
|
|
571 to be without a COMPUTER?!)
|
|
572 If any others who are attending would care to let us know how to
|
|
573 identify them leave msgs here. (Note this is NOT required)
|
|
574 I hope piper, Wassir, & the Mckane Enterprises rep will attend. If not,
|
|
575 there is a meeting every two weeks.
|
|
576 """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""Green Eyes"""""(feeling VERY out of character)
|
|
577 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
|
|
578
|
|
Can you legislate something like gun control? It seems more like a
|
|
579
|
|
cultural phenomenum of an insecure & paranoid people. Vote for
|
|
580
|
|
Jesse Jackson. -- Pops --
|
|
581
|
|
*************************************************************************
|
|
582 I, too, should like to hear the instances of downtown violence, MIG. It
|
|
583 might bring theory and politics down to the local, pragmatic level. Dave
|
|
584 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
|
|
585 ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
|
|
586 Deborah,Dave:I have been attacked 2 times in my life,both in downtown
|
|
587 portland,both`at night.the first happened at the corner arcade in txhe
|
|
588 grayhhoound bus terminal`block^@F8D(
|
|
589
|
|
590 something is going on here!
|
|
591 it started afte I had just purchased a semi-controled subwtance from
|
|
592 a local vendor,somebody who evidently watche`d t the whole thing tried to`
|
|
593 obpatain all of my possesions by using ca knife of the size frank ivance
|
|
594 wanted banned.the second one was at apartment on 35th and division when
|
|
595 someone tried to break e(just lost my modem)ok,i think.
|
|
596 tried to break in to the place,I might add`that I had no clothing on
|
|
597 (niether did the`person I was with) in this case I was not actualy attacked
|
|
598 but I brained
|
|
599 him`anyway for interupting me!
|
|
600 Leonard:wanna sell your modem 1??? PLEASE!!!!!!!
|
|
601 The Man in Gray
|
|
602 ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
|
|
603 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
|
|
604 THE FOLLOWING IS AN EXCERT FROM THE WORDS OF GHANDI......COME ON..
|
|
605 YOU REEMEMBER.....MAHATMA!
|
|
606 "I OBJECT TO VIOLENCE BECAUSE, WHEN IT APPEARS TO DO GOOD, THE GOOD IS
|
|
607 ONLY TEMPORARY, THE EVIL IT DOES IS PERMANENT".
|
|
608
|
|
609 "UNLESS THE WORLD ADOPTS NONVIOLENCE, IT WILL SPELL CERTAIN SUICIDE
|
|
610 FOR MANKIND".
|
|
611 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
|
|
612 Ayeeeeeeeeeeeeee
|
|
613 ***********************************************
|
|
614 GEE, I THOUGHT PAM WAS GOING TO SHOW UP BY NOW. SIGH......
|
|
615 ********************************************************
|
|
616 Greetings:
|
|
617 First off, Deborah, I don't usually offer an opinion on such things pro
|
|
618 or con like gun control, abortion, or other such items of debate, but what
|
|
619 you are suggesting as far as a tight national gun control program would be
|
|
620 nigh well on impossible to institute. The point that Leonard made about an-
|
|
621 imal starvation is very accurate. Hunting, while I do not participate in it
|
|
622 , serves an intrinsically important function in keeping animal populations
|
|
623 under control. Failure to do so would eventually result in the total death
|
|
624 of such herds as deer, elk, moose, etc. There is a point after which the
|
|
625 environment can no longer support vast quantities of animals. Witness the
|
|
626 third-world countries (and I am NOT implying that they are animals, but the
|
|
627 same principles apply). Also: The plan that you propose would, I believe,
|
|
628 lead to a total police state similar to that in 1984. It would be one step
|
|
629 closer to the Big Brother concept. Outa room. Bye. Whiskey Vic.
|
|
|
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> |