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600 lines
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FILE ON
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MARGIN IS 128
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STATUS: ALL ALLOWED
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NUMBER OF LINES: 595
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1 If you are in need of help, you need but ask....
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2 ******************** REMOVED: 21 AUG 83 ********************************
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3 Welcome to BWMS (BackWater Message System) Mike Day System operator
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4 ************************************************************
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5 GENERAL DISCLAIMER: BWMS IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INFORMATION PLACED ON
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6 THIS SYSTEM.
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7 BWMS was created as an electronic bill board. BWMS is a privatly owned
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8 and operated system which is currently open for use by the general public.
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9 No restrictions are placed on the use of the system.
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10 It is intended that the system be normally used for messages and
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11 advertisments by the users. As the system is privatly owned, I retain the
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12 right to remove any and all messages which I may find offensive
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13 to me. Additionally because of the limited size of the system, it will be
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14 periodically purged of older messages. (only 629 lines of data can be saved)
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15 The saved information will be cycled to drive 'B' while the information on
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16 drive 'B' will be archived, and a fresh disk will be installed in drive 'A'.
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17 To leave a message, type 'ENTER' and use ctrl/C or break to get out
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18 of the enter mode. The message is automaticly stored.
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19 If after entering the message you find you made a mistake,
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20 use the replace command to replace the line.
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21 To exit from the system, type 'OFF' then hang up.
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22 Type 'HELP' to see other commands that are available on the system.
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23 ========================================
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24
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25
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26 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
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27 WELL, FOLKS, WE NOW HAVE A NEW DISK. I HOPE THAT WE CAN GET ON TO SOME
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28 NEW SUBJECTS. THE GENETIC ENGINEERING ONE SEEMS TO HAVE PROMISE, AND I
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29 HAVE SOME TO PROPOSE. FIRST, I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHY IT SEEMS THAT, WHEN
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30 THE SUBJECTS GETS ONTO SOMETHING THAT IS EXTREMELY EMOTIONAL, MOST OF THE
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31 WRITERS IGNORE PART OR ALL OF WHAT THE PERSON TO WHOM THEY ARE RESPONDING
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32 SAID. THE OTHER RELATES TO THE GENDER OF THE USERS OF THIS (AND OTHER)
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33 SYSTEMS. I NOTICE THAT MOST (I WOULD SAY ALL, BUT MANY DO NOT EVEN USE A
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34 PSEUDONYM, SO I CAN ONLY GUESS) OF YOU ARE MALE. AS A RELATIVELY NEW USER
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35 I AM CURIOUS AS TO WHY THERE ARE NO OTHER FEMALES ON THIS BOARD, OR WITH
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36 COMPUTERS OR TERMINALS IN GENERAL. DON'T YOU GUYS EVER SHARE YOUR TOYS
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37 WITH YOUR GIRLFRIENDS? I KNOW THAT I WOULD NEVER HAVE BECOME INVOLVED IN
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38 ANY OF THIS IF A VERY CLOSE FRIEND HADN'T LET ME USE HIS TERMINAL. I
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39 ALWAYS THOUGHT "OH, JUST ANOTHER GADGET. HE LOVES HIS TOYS." BUT I
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40 FOUND THAT I ENJOYED THE VARIOUS BBS SYSTEMS SO MUCH, THAT I FINALLY
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41 BOUGHT MY OWN COMPUTER. IT WAS MORE MONEY THAN I AM USED TO SPENDING ON
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42 WHAT SOME WOULD CALL A FRIVOLOUS EXTRAVAGANCE, BUT WHAT FUN! SO LETS HEAR
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43 FROM YOUR LADY-FRIENDS, GUYS. OR AT LEAST LETS HEAR WHY THEY'RE NOT
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44 INTERESTED.
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45
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46 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][]PAM[][][][]
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47
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48 Someone suggested that we use genetic engineering to improve
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49 humanity
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50 (or something like that). Well, I read an article on the subject
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51 about 15 or 20 years ago! (If anyone is REALLY interested, I get
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52 the month/yr of the mag as I know that Multnomah Co. Library has
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53 it). A rather interesting point was made. Sometimes, you NEED those
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54 "bad" recessives. The best example is sickle cell anemia. If you
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55 have 2 recessives you die fairly young of sickle cell. Yet this gene
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56 is COMMON in the Black population of Africa (and here!). Why?
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57 After some study it developed that the combination of 1 sickle
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58 cell gene and 1 "normal" gene gives GREATLY increased resistance
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59 to malaria! Thus, those with the gene doubled die AND SO DO THOSE
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60 WITHOUT it!
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61 The point (in case you missed it) is that even "bad" genes
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62 can be benificial (if they STAY recessive). So be careful, your
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63 "improvements" might kill us all if some environmental factor
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64 changes. We need as LARGE a gene pool as possible. (We also need
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65 some NON-DESTRUCTIVE means of screening the gene pattern of ova
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66 & sperm.)
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67 ________________________________Leonard_______________________
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68
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69 To the above person who wanted to know why there weren't many females on
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70 the system. Have you ever seen us bunch of computer users. We are are
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71 motly crew to say the least. Most of us don't have girl friends, or
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72 for that matter, friends who are girls. No self-respecting female would
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73 be caught dead with the likes of us. You are a lucky one, having a chance
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74 to dabble for yourself in the world of computerized information systems.
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75 Most females are turned off by computers after they see what the average
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76 computer male looks like and acts like. Naturally there are exceptions,
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77 but for the most part, us computer males are not what you would call
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78 'lady-killers'. A very large percentage are not married, and many never
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79 have been. It is a shame, but alas, the computer is a harsh misteriss
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80 (apologies to Heinline).
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81
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82 $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
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83 DEAR PAM,LEONARD, ET AL
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84 PAM-I SHOWED MY WIFE HOW THIS BBS WORKED A COUPLE OF NIGHTS AGO AND
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85 HER EYES GLAZED OVER WITH ENTHUSIASM. WOMEN COMPRISE ABOUT 10 OR 15
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86 PERCENT OF PROFESSIONAL PROGRAMMERS (WHAT I AM) EVEN THOUGH IBM,DEC AND
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87 THE REST HAVE VERY AGGRESSIVE PROGRAMS FOR HIRING WOMEN AND THE WAGES
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88 ARE HIGH. WHAT WITH THE LABOR SHORTAGE IN THIS FIELD, ANYBODY WHO COULD
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89 PROGRAM AND WANTED A JOB HAS BEEN HIRED, OR NEARLY SO.
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90 I DONT THINK, (RE THE LAST ENTRY BEFORE THIS) THAT WE NEED TO BE CATAGOR-
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91 IZED QUITE SO HARSHLY, OLD SUN. TRUE, ON ATTENDING THE KAYPRO USERS GROUP
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92 MEETING THE OTHER NIGHT I WAS SURPRISED TO FIND OUT HOW MANY HOBBY
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93 AFICIONADOS LOOK LIKE ME (JEANS, BALD, BEARD, BAD POSTURE) BUT ON THE OTHER
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94 HAND AT LEAST A HALF OF THEM LOOKED LIKE RUNNERS OR SWIMMERS OR SOMETHING.
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95 A GROUP OF D.P.'PROFESSIONALS' WOULD HAVE A FEW MORE THREE-PIECERS IN THE
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96 CROWD, AND PROBABLY MORE WOMEN THAN I SAW AMONG THE HOBBIESTS. ANYHOW,
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97 AS THE OLD SAYING GOES, YOU CAN GET A WOMEN EVEN IF YOU'RE BROKE, FAT,
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98 OR SMELL LIKE A SKUNK. BUT FORGET IT IF YOU'RE ALL THREE.
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99 AS A MATTER OF FACT, THOUGH I BELIEVE THAT A LARGE PERCENTAGE
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100 OF THE WOMEN HACKERS I KNOW ARE SINGLE AS WELL AS THE MEN. I THINK THIS
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101 DOES NOT REALLY RELATE TO LOOKS AS SOME OF THEM ARE DEFINITELY OK AS WELL
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102 AS HAVING THE ADDED ATTRACTION OF BEING INTELLIGENT. (BEING BRIGHT IS AN
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103 ATTRACTIVE FEATURE TO PEOPLE, AS LONG AS YOU CAN REFRAIN FROM BEING
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104 OBNOXIOUS ABOUT IT, OLD SUN). BUT HOW CAN PEOPLE WITH SUCH SOLITARY
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105 PERSUITS MEET ANYONE? THIS IS AN OLD PROBLEM, THAT BBS'S, THE CHAT'S AND
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106 CB'S MAY HELP WITH ESPECIALLY IF YOU'RE PART OF THE SMALL FEMALE CONTINGENT
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107 ON THESE SYSTEMS, BUT PROBABLY THE MEN WILL HAVE TO BEAR THE CROSS OF THEIR
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108 AVOCATIONS WITH AS MUCH GRACE AS THEY CAN MUSTER OR FAILING THAT, GET AWAY
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109 FROM THGE TERMINAL ONCE IN A WHILE AND ASK SOMEONE OUT. (**DONT** TALK
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110 ABOUT COMPUTERS!)
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111 MEANWHILE I'M SURE GLAD THAT PAT AT LEAST IS ON THE SYSTEM.
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112 LEONARD - RIGHT, SINGLE-GENE SICKLE CELL DOES OFFER SOME PROTECTION
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113 AGAINST MALARIA, BUT SO WHAT. QUININE AND SPRAYING STILL WATER TO KILL
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114 THE LARVAE BOTH WORK A LOT BETTER. LETTING NEW YORK BLACKS KEEP SICKLE-CELL
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115 SO THEY'LL HAVE MARGINAL PROTECTION AGAINST MALARIA SEEMS QUITE A DRACONIAN
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116 MEASURE, TO SAY THE LEAST.
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117 BESIDES, WHAT DOES BEING NEARSIGHTED GET ME. PROTECTION FROM TV COMMERCIALS?
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118 HOW ABOUT BEING BORN MICROCEPHALIC - IS THERE A BENEFIT THERE? I THINK THE
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119 SITUATIONS YOU CAN POINT TO WHERE THERE IS SOME SLIM COMPENSATION FOR A
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120 GENETIC DRAWBACK ARE FEW AND FAR BETWEEN.
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121 BUT I DON'T THINK THAT THE DISCUSSION SHOULD BE LIMITED TO 'FIXING'
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122 THINGS WITH GENETICS.
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123 FIRST, WE MIGHT TALK ABOUT THE POSSIBILITY OF FINDING AND EXCISING THE
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124 GENES FOR AGING. THIS IS BEGINNING TO LOOK QUITE POSSIBLE. SO MUCH SO
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125 THAT A RECENTLY READ AN ARTICLE BY SOME GOVERNMENT LIBERALS PROTESTING
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126 THE 'IRRESPONSIBILITY' OF SUCH A DEVELOPMENT, BECAUSE IT WOULD SCREW UP
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127 ALL THEIR PLANS FOR US. OTHER PEOPLE HATE THE IDEA OF LIVING THAT LONG
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128 (SEEMS TO BE THE MAJORITY VEIW). I DON'T LIKE THE IDEA OF DYING BECAUSE
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129 I DON'T BELEIVE IN ANY RELIGION.
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130 SECOND BIG ONE - WHAT ABOUT INCREASING OUR INTELLIGENCE. WE HAVE A
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131 LOT OF THEORIES THESE DAYS ABOUT WHY THE JAPANESE ARE AHEAD OF US IN SO
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132 MANY WAYS AFTER BEING A FEUDAL STATE 100 YEARS AGO. USUALLY THOUGH WE
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133 DON'T DISCUSS THE FACT THAT THE AVERAGE JAPANESE HAS AN I.Q. OVER 14
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134 POINTS HIGHER THAN OURS. (I.Q. EXPERTS SAY THAT I.Q. IS 80% HEREDITY)
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135 WILL WE ADAPT OURSELVES OR JUST BE CONTENT WITH THE SITUATION. AND NOTHING
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136 SAYS THAT WE COULDN'T ALL HAVE I.Q.S IN THE 200'S. I VISITED A G.E. LAB
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137 A FEW MONTHS AGO AND NOBODY THERE WAS LAUGHING AT THESE IDEAS.
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138 WHILE I WAS THERE I GOT TO SEE A BACTERIA COLONY MANUFACTUING SNOW AT
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139 75 DEGREES FARENHEIT! SO DON'T BELEIVE THAT THE POSSIBILITIES ARE
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140 LIMITED BY WHAT SEEMS REASONABLE HERE. FANTASTIC THINGS CAN BE DONE.
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141 AND THERE IS SOME POSSIBILITY THAT THESE IMPROVEMENTS CAN BE RETRO-
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142 FITTED INTO ALL OF US, USING TECHNIQUES NOW UNDER DEVELOPMENT.
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143
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144 RAMBLE,RAMBLE.......................
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145 CHUCK
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146 $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
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147 -_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-
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148 - Ah Chuck, you present some interesting ideas. I would surely like to see -
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149 - that bacteria colony manafacturing snow at 75 degrees Fahrenheit. And what -
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150 - practical use would be found for this? -
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151 - What about the fear that a mad geneticist would create a super-human -
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152 - monster which would be better mentally and physically then the average -
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153 - human being? I know of at least one movie based on this. (Blade Runner.) -
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154 - What say you overly-intelligent people? ............................Pioneer -
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155 -_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-
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156 BEFORE WE START GETTING INVOLVED IN MAKING LIFE LONGER ETC. WE SHOULD FIGURE
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157 OUT HOW TO FEED, CLOTHE, & HOUSE THOSE YHAT ARE ALREADY HERE. HOW ABOUT PUTTING
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158 ALL THIS CREATIVE THINKING INTO SUCH A USEFULE PUESRSUIT. JUST THINK OF THE BY
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159 PRODUCTS OF SUCH PROBLEM SOLVING. NO MORE WARS, S ETC.
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160 __
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161 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\:::
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162
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163 genetics is genocide. How dare we dabble with the work of god. I love the
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164 comment by CHUCK above. `I am afraid to die because I don`t believe in
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165 any religion.' That sir, is precious. I am going to give that quote to
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166 my minister so he can use it in an upcoming sermon. Thank you very much
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167 for the quote. You have given every god-fearing person who hears or
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168 reads it a reason to believe in God even more.
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169
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170 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
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171 your attention please.
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172
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173 i think that genetic engineering
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174 is a wonderful idea. though the
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175 applications are awesome, we should
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176 not rush into taking are own dna
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177 , chopping it up, turning it
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178 around and making it in mass
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179 quanities. as far as i know,
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180 we have already taken a few small
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181 steps into this field. if you
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182 wanted, i could tell you all
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183 about that kind of stuff, since
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184 my next door neighbor is a
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185 clinical microbiologist. but
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186 this subject has its limitations
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187 as far as interest is concerned,
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188 so i'm not going to talk anymore
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189
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190 thank you for
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191 letting m
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192 bore you to
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193 your grave.
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194
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195 }{}{}{}{}{}{general berringer}{
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196
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197
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198 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
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199 MAD SCIENTISTS? WELL, I'VE READ BOOKS AND I'VE SEEN MOVIES THAT HAVE THAT
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200 AS A PREMISE, AND IT SEEMS TO BE A POPULAR ONE. BUT DOES ANYONE OUT THERE
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201 KNOW OF A CASE IN THE HISTORY OF SCIENCE OF A "MAD" SCIENTIST CREATING A
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202 MONSTER? WHILE IT MIGHT HAPPEN, IT IS ONLY A HYPOTHESIS UNTIL WE HAVE
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203 SOME EVIDENCE OF IT HAPPENING SOMEWHERE. OTHERWISE, WHILE BEING AN
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204 INTERESTING IDEA, IT CAN'T BE CONSIDERED AS EVIDENCE IN AN ARGUMENT.
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205 AS FAR AS GOD IS CONCERNED, TIME AND AGAIN HE IS BROUGHT INTO THE
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206 DEBATE ABOUT SOME NEW CONCEPT, SUBJECT, OR INVENTION, USUALLY WITH THE
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207 PHRASE (OR SOMETHING SIMILAR), "IF GOD HAD MEANT MAN TO ________ (FILL IN
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208 THE BLANK), HE WOULD HAVE ________ (FILL IN THE BLANK). I DON'T THINK
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209 THAT ANY OF US IS IN A POSITION TO SAY WHAT GOD THINKS. AND SUCH A
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210 STATEMENT CANNOT BE USED AS EVIDENCE, SINCE IT CONSTITUTES HEARSAY. IT'S
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211 NOT GOD SAYING IT, IT'S SOMEONE SAYING THAT GOD THINKS IT. WE CAN'T
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212 ACCEPT IT IN THE ARGUMENT UNLESS WE HEAR IT FROM GOD, NOT ONE OF HIS
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213 SELF-APPOINTED SPOKESMEN. REMEMBER, IF GOD HAD INTENTED MAN TO USE
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214 COMPUTER TERMINALS, WE WOULD HAVE BEEN BORN WITH TELEPHONE MODULAR PLUGS
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215 ON OUR FINGERS AND MICROPROCESSORS IN OUR NOSES.
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216
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217 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]PAM[][][]
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218
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219 On the other hand, consider the pressure that would exist if everyone
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220 had a chance at immortality instead of just 'three score and ten' -
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221 there might be a lot fewer that would be willing to throw their lives
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222 away -- perhaps this is the road to peace????
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223 ---------Grey Ghost---------------------------------------
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224 ---------------------------------------------
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225 Some one up yonder (Leanord I think) was makeing a case for not limiting
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226 the gene pool. I totally agree. My basic point on that score was that we need this type if research to establish
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227 our own genetic ecology. To understand
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228 that there may be rescessives that are
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229 needed under special curcumstances is
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230 useful, but I think that most of them
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231 do more harm then good and should be removed.
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232
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233 Paul
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234 ----------------------------------------------------
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235
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236 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
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237 I think that both of you are correct. We must examine all attributes of genotypes before deciding if they are
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238 desireable. We must know if what appears to be a "bad" characteristic has some good to offer. The genetic diversity of
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239 a species is what protects it from disaster by plagues and environmental changes. But then, understanding better what
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240 genes allow increased immunity would be helpful. I think that the earliest uses will be the manufacture of chemicals
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241 and serums that would be prohibitively expensive to make using traditional technology. Here's a specific posibility:
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242 How about a edible plant, vegetable, or fruit that has proteins with amino acids that are much closer to human needs,
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243 making it easier for vegetarians to have a properly balanced diet. It takes much less energy per calorie to grow
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244 vegetables and grains than to produce meat.
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245 /Elberich\
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246 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
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247 ****************************************************************************
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248
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249 HI YOUALL!
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250
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251 ****************************************************************************
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252 ----------------------------------------------
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253 Elberich:
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254 Good ... already in progress on that one ie. a new semi-synthetic insulin
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255 is already being mass produced also
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256 I have read of a new strain of wheat
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257 that is suppose to be extremely harty and able to grow in very poor soil.
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258 How about developments into the
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259 area of 'growing' protein rather the silicon computers that are compatable
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260 with human proteins ... an implantable
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261 ROM that could give a person a working knowledge of a specific subject or
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262 as an augmentor to our brains that
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263 would be say a thought-access calculator?
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264
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265 Paul
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266
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267 -----------------------------------------------
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268 Would, or have, any of you seriously chosen a mate--or chosen to look further--
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269 with the idea of naturally engineering your own genes for the desired traits
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270 to be embodied by your offspring? Or are we again just acting out an exercise
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271 in science and philosophy? Or is this another intellectual competition after
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272 which we all say, "Let those microbiologists do all these neat things and we'll
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273 take legal action against them or against their results if it offends us later
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274 on."?
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275 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Dave ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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276 ---------------------------------------------
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277 Dave:
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278 Pardon ????
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279 Paul
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280 ----------------------------------------------
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281
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282
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283 Consider death. For billions of years, our matter floated around in the
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284 universe, just waiting (so to speak) for us to materialize. An instant
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285 (relatively speaking) later, we die, and our matter floats away forever. So
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286 what do we value? Our bodies, or our mind? (religious types will call it a
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287 'soul') Isn't it a waste of a sentient being to die? That may be the origin
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288 of religion: The idea that one will not last forever is so unthinkable as to
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289 demand some sort of reprieve. Reincarnation, heaven, etc.
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290 I'm not religious, but I can easily see why others are. Death may not
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291 be a biological necessity, but so far it is an evolutionary necessity.
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292 ???????????????Pardon me while I go crazy????????????????????????????????????
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293 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
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294 DAVE, THE IDEA OF PRODUCING A CHILD TO SPECIFICATION BY MARRYING A
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295 PERSON WITH THOSE QUALIFICATIONS REMINDS ME OF THE STORY OF THE BEAUTIFUL
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296 WOMAN WHO WANTED TO HAVE A CHILD BY THE SMARTEST MAN IN THE WORLD. WHEN SHE
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297 FOUND SOMEONE SHE FELT CAME CLOSE TO WHAT SHE WANTED, SHE TOLD HIM THAT SHE
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298 WANTED A CHILD WITH HIS BRAINS AND HER BEAUTY. HE ASKED HER HOW SHE WAS SURE
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299 THAT THE CHILD WOULDN'T WIND UP WITH HER BRAINS AND HIS (LACK OF) BEAUTY.
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300 THE MORAL OF THIS STORY (SORRY, BUT IT SOUNDS LIKE A FAIRY TALE THE WAY I
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301 TOLD IT), IS THAT YOU CAN'T PREDICT WHAT TRAITS YOUR CHILD WILL INHERIT WHEN
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302 THE GENETIC DICE IS THROWN. AND, BESIDES, I THINK THE IDEA IS TO ELIMINATE
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303 RECESSIVE TRAITS THAT ARE BAD, OR TO ADD DESIREABLE TRAITS THAT DON'T EXIST.
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304
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305 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][]PAM[][][][]
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306
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307 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
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308 Paul,
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309 I wasn't aware of those advances, and it serves to remind me of how fast things are changing. How about this:
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310 The human body is not capable of producing many of the vitamins it needs. Some it only needs in minute quantities,
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311 and others are easily available in the food around us. But some, like vitamin C, are not so easy to get. We have no
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312 trouble getting it because of the availability of canned fruits, supplements, etc., but it would be so much easier if
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313 we could produce them in our own bodies. Could gene manipulation produce a change in one of our internal organs so
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314 that it would produce these substances?
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315 Food for thought (oh, puke, excuse me!).
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316 /Elberich\
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317 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
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318 STAR WARS IWOULD LIKE TO TALK
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319 ?
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320 HELP
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321
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322
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323
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324
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325
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326
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327 HELP
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328
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329 LOST
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330
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331 Q
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332 ................................
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333 Elberich: you don't need any "gross" changes (new organs etc) to
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334 make your own vitamin C. We probably STILL HAVE the required genes,
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335 but they are blocked. A suprising amount of our DNA is "masked".
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336 A point that will annoy some of the religious fanatics is that
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337 there is an almost 99% match (in codon sequences, NOT NECESSARILY
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338 genes) among human, gorilla & chimpanzee DNA. Many researchers
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339 feel that it would be possible to cross humans & chimps. The
|
||
340 ONLY reason it hasn't been tried is the moral questions involved.
|
||
341 I mention all this because chimps & gorillas DO make their own
|
||
342 vitamin C!
|
||
343 I'm not too sure about the "superman" idea. What are you
|
||
344 going to do to "improve" us. Aside from MINOR things like the
|
||
345 vitamin C bit, I can't think of any MAJOR changes that are possible
|
||
346 AND don't "over-specialize" us. Remember, our "big" advantage is
|
||
347 non-specialization.
|
||
348 As for the recessives, they don't cause problems AS LONG
|
||
349 AS THEY AREN'T PAIRED. That is why I'd like to see some way of
|
||
350 "sorting" sperm & ova. (this MIGHT avoid some of the "moral
|
||
351 majority" (sic) arguments) (if they decide that sperm & unfertilized
|
||
352 ova have a "right to life"(?) I give up!) Among other considerations.
|
||
353 I think this would be MUCH safer than messing with the kid's
|
||
354 genes!
|
||
355 ___________________________Leonard_________________________
|
||
356 -_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-
|
||
357 - Another achievement of genetic engineering is the production of a bacteria -
|
||
358 - which stores an electrical charge. They are intended as the heart of a bio- -
|
||
359 - chip which, due to the small size of the bacteria, will contain many more -
|
||
360 - on/off than any of the present-day microchips. The technology is currently -
|
||
361 - being developed which will guide the bacteria to grow in an orderly fashion -
|
||
362 - and to give us the capability to read/write the electrical charge. Ain't -
|
||
363 - that neat? Pretty soon we'll have "living" computers. (Can't you imagine -
|
||
364 - it? Sea anemone for the keyboard, terminal made out of dozens of tiny fire- -
|
||
365 - flies, etc...) .....................................................Pioneer -
|
||
366 -_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-
|
||
367 #####################################################################
|
||
368 US BRIGHT AND INTELLIGENT PEOPLE SHOULD TAKE MAYBE A LITTLE MORE
|
||
369 CARE WHEN TALKING TO OTHERS ON THE SYSTEM "OLD SON". IT ALWAYS
|
||
370 LOOKS SO MUCH MORE INTELLIGENT IF YOU CAN SPELL THE WORD CORRECTLY FOR THE
|
||
371 CONTEXT IN WHICH YOU ARE USING IT.
|
||
372
|
||
373 SORRRY
|
||
374
|
||
375 ########################################################################
|
||
376
|
||
377 Genetic engineering didn't start with the biochemists. All the food you eat,
|
||
378 as well as much of the clothes you wear are already the result of genetic
|
||
379 engineeriing. The selection of better breeds of sheep, corn wheat, etc. has
|
||
380 been going on now for about 4,000 years that we have record of, and probalbly
|
||
381 for the previous 4,000 also. An engineer doesn't need to know exactly how or
|
||
382 why something works, he only needs to know it does. An excelent example is
|
||
383 the cathedrals of Europe, all of which were built long before material science
|
||
384 could explain why arches worked; long before we could analyze the wind forces,
|
||
385 etc. They were built, though, very well thank you.
|
||
386 Yes, the sickle cell trait does offer some portection against malaria, but
|
||
387 natural evolution doesn't use perfect solutions, it only selects what is
|
||
388 available due to natural mutation. With, say, gene splicing, and a knowlege
|
||
389 of what we want, we can create genes that would give malaria protection,
|
||
390 without the sickling. What simple modifcations could be made to a human?
|
||
391 How about the ability to efficiently eat grass? (and survive on it.) or make
|
||
392 vitamins? drink sea water? live at lower temperatures? breath sea water?
|
||
393 Living in the sea is cetainly a great specialization, it would cut us off from
|
||
394 3/5's of our planet. How about longer useful life, or better resistance to
|
||
395 infectious diseases (no cancer?) how about the ability, like some simpler
|
||
396 aninals, to regrow cut off limbs? We don't need or want bad genes in our pool!
|
||
397 Humans don't respond to changes in environment by evolving, we change the
|
||
398 environment, or wear clothes.
|
||
399 AS to the fear we could create a monster, with our 3 billion humans, it would
|
||
400 be quite a superhuman who could take over the world, and such a being might
|
||
401 protect us from the human dictators who are doing it already.
|
||
402 I don't fear science, I fear ignorance.
|
||
403 //////////////////////////////////////BAD\\\1230 17-aug-83\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
|
||
404
|
||
405 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
|
||
406 I DON'T THINK THAT DOMESTICATION EXACTLY QUALIFIES AS GENETIC ENGINEERING.
|
||
407 THAT IS ARTIFICIAL SELECTION OF EXISTING CHARACTERISTICS, PICKING THOSE
|
||
408 THAT BEST FIT YOUR NEEDS. BESIDES, AS YOU POINTED OUT, IT TAKES A LOOOONG
|
||
409 TIME. HOW ABOUT ONE THAT ISAAC ASIMOV SUGGESTED A SOME TIME AGO: ALLOWING
|
||
410 WOMEN TO BE FERTILE ONLY BY CHOICE, OR ONLY AT SPECIFIC TIMES, WITH
|
||
411 OBVIOUS SIGNS OF WHEN THOSE TIMES ARE. NO MORE ARTIFICIAL BIRTH CONTROL,
|
||
412 NO MORE PRE-MENSTRUAL SYNDROME, NO MORE FEELING LOUSY, AND NO MORE SHOTGUN
|
||
413 WEDDINGS!! ANY WOMAN THAT BECAME PREGNANT WOULD HAVE DONE SO BY CHOICE.
|
||
414
|
||
415 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][]PAM[][][][]
|
||
416
|
||
417 *********************************************************
|
||
418 The Hoodview Amateur Radio Club will hold it's first
|
||
419 Hamfair/Computer show Aug 27 9-6, and Aug 28 9-3 at MT.
|
||
420 Hood Community College gym. There will be comerical
|
||
421 diaplays,food and swap tables (for radio and computer items
|
||
422 only). The admission is $2.00 ,12 and under free. Swap
|
||
423 tables are $5.00 . For more information contact Bob at
|
||
424 771-xxxx.
|
||
425 **********************Bob********************************
|
||
426 The proceeding was a paid political
|
||
427 announcement.
|
||
428 **************************************
|
||
429 BOB WISHES IT WERE PAID FOR!
|
||
430 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~WHAT?~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
|
||
432
|
||
433
|
||
434 ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
|
||
435
|
||
436 HUH?
|
||
437
|
||
438 -----------------------------------------------
|
||
439 Pam:
|
||
440 Would you like to propose a mechanism to
|
||
441 accomplish your suggestion?
|
||
442
|
||
443 Paul
|
||
444 -----------------------------------------------
|
||
445
|
||
446 Yes, domestication is definitely "engineering", it changed the breed ,
|
||
447 for a specific use. (It may not have been intentional.) Pam, you speak of
|
||
448 "engineering" a better woman; but should conraception be only a woman's
|
||
449 choice? Male cycles being less regular and less pronounced I don't know
|
||
450 about pre-menstrual problems, you may be right there.
|
||
451 A word of caution: the first mass produced drug that was designed by use
|
||
452 of a knowlege of molecular biochemistry was thalidomide. It is still the safest
|
||
453 known tranquilizer: massive overdoses don't kill, side effects are rare; but
|
||
454 one side effect was enough: when given to a pregnant woman...... The studies
|
||
455 on lower animals didn't show this effect, because it is specific to higher
|
||
456 mammals. Right about now the first intentional release of gene spliced
|
||
457 bacteria into the outside environment is being done, near Tule lake, norther
|
||
458 California. Why? To reduce frost damage to potatos. Seems the wild strain
|
||
459 of bacteria cause frost nucleation that damages the spuds, the hope is that
|
||
460 the new ones, without the frost gene will be safer. Now: what else does it do?
|
||
461 Perhaps we will know later..... Is 300 miles far enough??
|
||
462 ////////////////////////BAD\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
|
||
463 Just read the last of disk B. A reference to democracy was answered by a claim
|
||
464 that we are a republic. True, but who elects the senators? We, the people,
|
||
465 still have power, a lot of it. (If you don't believe me, why do the politicians
|
||
466 spend so much time and effort getting elected?) As to the irate taxpayer, who
|
||
467 believes that taxes prevents him from hiring someone: all expenses, including
|
||
468 wages, are tax deductions:his claim that he needs someone implies he would
|
||
469 be some productive value out of him (more income), so I don't think he
|
||
470 understands what he is saying. Since he taught himself everything he knows, I
|
||
471 also suspect he does'nt read, because someone else wrote the books, or speak
|
||
472 the common tongue invented by someone else way back when. We owe one hell of
|
||
473 alot to society. If we only paid taxes on what we, individually, used, you had
|
||
474 better never need any social bennies, because they are paid for by all of us.
|
||
475 He also would be rather shocked how little he would get back if we allowed
|
||
476 him a rebate on what we would save if his kid isn't in public school. (let's
|
||
477 see: one less desk, but the teacher is still there, the room, the heat, the
|
||
478 janitor, the building, land, principal,lights,busses... But 1 fewer book.
|
||
479 Give the man about $30, I think he's worth it.
|
||
480 /////////////////////////////////////BAD\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
|
||
481 ?
|
||
482 IF YOUR A STAR WARS SAGA FAN LEAVE MESSAGE
|
||
483 IF YOU A***********************STAR WARS SAGA FAN**********************
|
||
484 PLEASE LEAVE A MESSAGE TO JILL,IAM NEW TO THIS SYSTEM.I REALY LIKE THE SAGA I W
|
||
485
|
||
486 }[][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
|
||
487 PAUL:
|
||
488 SURE!!! IT WAS MENTIONED EARLIER THAT HUMANS ARE THE ONLY CREATURES
|
||
489 NOT CAPABLE OF MANUFACTURING THEIR OWN VITAMIN C, AND THAT THE ABILITY
|
||
490 WAS PROBABLY STILL PRESENT, BUT MASKED. HUMANS FEMALES ARE ALSO THE ONLY
|
||
491 CREATURES THAT ARE ALWAYS SEXUALLY RECEPTIVE. MOST ANIMALS ENTER ESTRUS AT
|
||
492 SPECIFIC TIMES AND UNDER SPECIFIC STIMULI. IT HAS BEEN SUGGESTED BY
|
||
493 ANTHROPOLOGISTS THAT HUMAN FEMALES HAVE DEVELOPED CONTINUAL RECEPTIVITY
|
||
494 BECAUSE OF OUR HUNTER/GATHERER STATUS THROUGHOUT MUCH OF OUR DEVELOPMENT
|
||
495 FROM EARLIER TYPES. IT WAS NECESSARY FOR THE FEMALES TO BE ALWAYS READY
|
||
496 SINCE COPULATION MIGHT ONLY OCCUR RARELY. NOTE THAT EVEN OUR CLOSEST
|
||
497 RELATIVES AMOUNG THE GREAT APES ENTER A PERIOD OF "HEAT", AND ARE
|
||
498 UNRECEPTIVE THE REST OF THE TIME. SO, IF THE ABILITY TO PRODUCE VITAMIN C IS
|
||
499 MASKED, MIGHT NOT THIS ALSO BE MASKED? PERSONALLY, I WOULD FIND IT BORING
|
||
500 TO ONLY BE RECEPTIVE PART OF THE TIME, BUT I DON'T THINK THAT ORGASM IS
|
||
501 RELATED TO OVULATION, OR I WOULD ONLY HAVE ONE WHEN I WAS GOING TO GET
|
||
502 PREGNANT. UHH.....I HOPE I DIDN'T EMBARRESS ANY OF YOU GUYS. MAYBE I SHOULD
|
||
503 DELETE THAT LAST LINE. OH WELL........
|
||
504
|
||
505 [][][][][][][][][][][][][]PAM[][][][][]
|
||
506
|
||
507 Don't consider the fact that humans don't produce their own vitamin C a flaw.
|
||
508 After all, it is probable that this came about because humans were almost always
|
||
509 able to get enough for their requirements from the available food. In fact,
|
||
510 there are many chemicals that COULD be produced by the body, IF not enough were
|
||
511 consumed. These reactions are sometimes inefficient, so the body would 'rather'
|
||
512 not bother making them.
|
||
513 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
|
||
514 WELL, LET'S SEE WHAT THE LASTEST USE OF YOUR TAX DOLLAR IS BEING PUT TO.
|
||
515 AHH, HERE'S ONE. A VERY IMPORTANT STUDY BY THE DEPARTMENT OF HEATH; IT
|
||
516 SEEMS THAT AFTER A LONG STUDY, THEY HAVE COME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT
|
||
517 "INDIVIDUALS IN POOR HEALTH ARE ALMOST SEVEN TIMES AS FREQUENT USERS OF
|
||
518 PHYSICIAN SERVICES AS THOSE IN EXCELENT HEALTH." THAT'S RIGHT, THE
|
||
519 GOVERNMENT SPENT $180,000 TO PRODUCE A 40 PAGE REPORT THAT SAYS SICK
|
||
520 PEOPLE SEE DOCTORS MORE THEN HEALTHY PEOPLE. WHAT'S NEXT? A REPORT THAT
|
||
521 DEAD PEOPLE ARE MORE LIKLY TO BE BURYED THEN LIVE PEOPLE?
|
||
522 ********************************************************************
|
||
523
|
||
524 I see we have a vote from BAD to keep people on welfare instead of putting
|
||
525 them work. Anybody else have any vote?
|
||
526 By the way BAD, you seem to be in need of a business education yourself
|
||
527 as you have shown a distinct lack of understanding of cash flow.
|
||
528 You have to have the money first before you can use it. (or at least with
|
||
529 in a reasonable period of time.) Also, you do not get instant return upon
|
||
530 hiring a new employee. It can take anywhere from a month (if they are
|
||
531 already trained) to a year or more (if they are not trained) to get a
|
||
532 return on the investment. Also, I wonder if you realize exactly how much
|
||
533 it costs an employer to hire someone. Did you know that on an average
|
||
534 it costs the employer what you make in wages for every thing you don't
|
||
535 see behind your paycheck. Did you also know that in most businesses that
|
||
536 wages are the single largest expenditure of the business, often completely
|
||
537 overshadowing all other costs? I do not agree at all with your assesment
|
||
538 of the Irrate Taxpayers problem.
|
||
539 +++++++++++++ Not the Irrate Taxpayer ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
|
||
540 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
|
||
541 JUST A LITTLE THOUGHT RE EMPLOYEES: FROM WHERE I SIT THE EMPLOYERS WOULD HAVE
|
||
542 NOTHING IF IT WASN'T FOR THE EMPLOYEE!
|
||
543 JUST WHO THE HELL DO YOU THINK DOES ALL THE DIRTY WORK TO MAKE YOU ABLE TO PAY
|
||
544 TAXES AND COMPLAIN ABOUT IT. IF EMPLOYERS ARE SO GREAT THEN LET THEM DO THEIR
|
||
545 OWN THING WITHOUT ANY HELP THEN WE WILL SEE JUST HOW SELF-MADE THEY ARE!!
|
||
546 THERE MAY BE SOME EXCEPTIONS TO THE ABOVE BUT IT IS PROBABLY LESS THAT 1/100TH
|
||
547 OF 1%.
|
||
548
|
||
549 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
|
||
550 What are you talking about? Did you read the messages in question?
|
||
551 The complaint was about not being able to hire an additional
|
||
552 employee. I'm not even sure what you are babbling about unless
|
||
553 it is simple hatred of your employer. If you hate it that much,
|
||
554 then why don't you find another job?
|
||
555 ++++++++++++ Not the Irrate Taxpayer +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
|
||
556
|
||
557 MAYBE HE'S A PHONE COMPANY EMPLOYEE WHO'S JUST TICKED OFF
|
||
558 AT EMPLOYERS IN GENERAL?
|
||
559
|
||
560 ..................................................................
|
||
561
|
||
562 Should I change disks? Things seem to be going rather hot and
|
||
563 heavy here. And it will certainly fill up before I get back.
|
||
564 Yes I guess I better, or then I'll be the butt of all the
|
||
565 complaints that evryone seems to enjoy throwing around here.
|
||
566 **** CISTOP MIKEY THE ARTFULL DODGER ***** 18 AUG 83 ***********
|
||
567 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
|
||
568 MIKEY, NO MATTER WHAT IS SAID BY THE VARIOUS PARTIES ON THIS SYSTEM, WE
|
||
569 ALL LOVE YOU!!!!! YOU PROVIDE US WITH A GREAT WAY TO EXCHANGE IDEAS, BLOW
|
||
570 OFF STEAM, AND IN GENERAL HAVE A GOOD TIME. AND FORGET WHAT SOMEONE SAID
|
||
571 EARLIER ON THIS DISK ABOUT "DEMANDING CHANGE" ON THIS SYSTEM. NO OTHER
|
||
572 SYSTEM IS AS ENJOYABLE AS THIS ONE, WITH ITS FREE-FORM STYLE, AND THE
|
||
573 ABILITY TO CHANGE PERSONNA. BY THE WAY, WHERE DID ALL THE FANTASY GO?
|
||
574 WHEN I FIRST TRIED THIS SYSTEM MONTHS AGO, POETRY AND FANTASY WAS
|
||
575 RAMPANT. NOW IT IS MOSTLY A DEBATING SOCIETY. I'M NOT COMPLAINING, JUST
|
||
576 CURIOUS.
|
||
577
|
||
578 [][][][][][][][][][][][][]PAM[][][][][]
|
||
579
|
||
580 beats me.
|
||
581 .........
|
||
582 Nope.... Fantasy blew out with storms....
|
||
583 -=-=-=-=-=Coo ra! Mikey knows, Pam...It take a delicate and inventive
|
||
584 touch to keep that spirit alive. Think of lace, think of sighing reeds
|
||
585 blending their music with the stream's voice...and add a woman's gentle
|
||
586 laugh...there you have it. Now take YOUR figurative pen, Pam, and invoke
|
||
587 the magic yourself; though I've seen but little of you, I sense you are
|
||
588 capable of it...Who am I? Suffice to say, a lady.-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
|
||
589 I HAVE TO AGREE WITH PAM ON THE LAST STATEMENT-THIS IS ONE BOARD I
|
||
590 SURE DO LIKE BECAUSE YOU CAN SAY ANYTHING YOU WANT -USING CONSIDERATION
|
||
591 OF OTHERS OR NOT-IT''S CALLED FREE FORM AND OUT OF THE 3 STATES AND
|
||
592 BOARDS I'VE USED-BACKWATER BEATS THEM ALL-I DON'T HAVE THE TIME TO
|
||
593 COMMENT ON THE VARIOUS THINGS THAT HAVE BEEN TALKED ABOUT BUT GIVE
|
||
594 MICKEY **********THREE CHEERS***********THE O.J.KID***************
|
||
595 ****.*****.*******************************************"********.*****OFF
|
||
|