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F I D O N E W S -- Vol.13 No.15 (08-Apr-1996)
+----------------------------+-----------------------------------------+
| A newsletter of the | ISSN 1198-4589 Published by: |
| FidoNet BBS community | "FidoNews" BBS |
| _ | +1-519-570-4176 |
| / \ | |
| /|oo \ | |
| (_| /_) | |
| _`@/_ \ _ | |
| | | \ \\ | Editors: |
| | (*) | \ )) | Donald Tees 1:221/192 |
| |__U__| / \// | |
| _//|| _\ / | |
| (_/(_|(____/ | |
| (jm) | Newspapers should have no friends. |
| | -- JOSEPH PULITZER |
+----------------------------+-----------------------------------------+
| Submission address: editors 1:1/23 |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| MORE addresses: |
| |
| submissions=> editor@exlibris.tdkcs.waterloo.on.ca |
| Don -- don@exlibris.tdkcs.waterloo.on.ca |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| For information, copyrights, article submissions, |
| obtaining copies of fidonews or the internet gateway faq |
| please refer to the end of this file. |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
========================================================================
Table of Contents
========================================================================
1. Editorial..................................................... 1
2. Articles...................................................... 2
MUSICIAN RETURNS!........................................... 2
An ugly DRAGON (Business Services, Inc.).................... 3
A Few Observations On Hobby Group Dynamics.................. 5
THE Fidonet homepage........................................ 8
Hello,...................................................... 9
Routed netmail: a German point of view...................... 9
3. Fidonews Information.......................................... 10
========================================================================
Editorial
========================================================================
FidoNews 13-15 Page: 2 08 Apr 1996
A good issue this week, with several interesting articles.
The specifications for Fidonews articles are laid out in a
document called ARTSPEC.DOC, freqable from this board, and
available throughout fidonet. However, perhaps I should
summarize them here.
The ideal is to send a file with a .ART extension. It
should be plain ASCII text, (no high order bits), and have no
lines of more than seventy-two characters. An asterisk(*) in the
first column is reserved for the title line.
Also accepted is netmail. Generally, I will format netmail
to the above specifications, and use the SUBJECT line as a
title. Please note that if the netmail contains quotations, and
the lines are all more than seventy-two lines long, then fixing
it up is a lot of work. That is also true of files out of
specification, and in columns.
If an article is so untidy that it is difficult to read (lines
of one or two words, followed by lines the width of the page,
five hundred lines in a single paragraph, etc.) then I will tidy
it up. I never change wording or spelling ... editing is
strictly on a formating basis.
English is prefered, but not required.
Quotations are quite alright, within reason. However, the
snooze is for articles, written by the submitter. It is not a
place to send fifty pages of quotations to prove a point, or
four thousand words of quotation with a single sentence added at
the bottom.
The reason I mention this is that I rejected two articles
this week. The first quoted my editorial in full, then an
article in full, then made a comment. I do not have a clue what
the second one said, as it was in some weird graphics format
that I do not have a reader for. I have written to both
authors, and explained why the articles are not in this issue.
On with the snooze.
========================================================================
Articles
========================================================================
MUSICIAN RETURNS!
by Bob Stephenson, 1:271/560
After mysteriously disapearing a couple of months ago, the MUSICIAN
echo has returned to the Backbone! It should be widely available by
the time you read this.
If you carried MUSICIAN on your system previously, you should
re-areafix it, since there's a good chance that your link(s) went away
when the echo did.
FidoNews 13-15 Page: 3 08 Apr 1996
MUSICIAN is open to any and all pro/semi-pro/amateur musicians and
songwriters. It's is usually populated by a number of working nightclub
musicians, songwriters, home recordists, and the overall atmosphere is
loose and good-natured. Topics can range from the serious ("how do I
negotiate with a club owner?"), the not-so-serious ("know any good
drummer jokes?"), and everything in between.
MUSICIAN is moderated by Bob Stephenson (1:271/560), currently the
bassist and co-songwriter with the full-time touring and recording
band, PCB.
So, come check it out! The echotag is MUSICIAN. See ya' there!
=Bob
----------------------------------------------------------------------
An ugly DRAGON (Business Services, Inc.)
An ugly DRAGON (Business Services, Inc.)
By Bill Roper 1:3801/1
billroper@tyler.net
April 5, 1996
I had a little problem rear its ugly head yesterday that could have
had a significant impact on the survival of my little board. I know
there are others in the same predicament and maybe what I have done
will help direct their anger/frustration/whatever in a more construct-
ive direction.
The sad tale (and happy conclusion) begins......
DRAGON BUSINESS SERVICES has provided a service for bulletin board
systems allowing bbs operators to "accept" credit card charges.
The information submitted in the credit card door is sent to DRAGON
BUSINESS SERVICES who process it for a fee of 9.3% of the total charge.
DRAGON BUSINESS SERVICES sends the money to you after three weeks
have elapsed, even though their contract with you calls for one week.
On April 3rd I received a note in the mail from DRAGON BUSINESS
SERVICES, a portion of which is quoted below. This "note", by the
way, was unsigned, on an otherwise blank sheet of paper. Had it not
come in an envelope bearing their return address I might have thought
it was someone's idea of a joke.
________________________________________________________
"We have arranged with our bank to be able to go back to the one week
hold. The one requirement of the bank is that we will now be required
to maintain a rather large reserve account. In order to raise the
funds for this account ALL SALES RECEIVED BY US FROM FEBRUARY 28, 1996
TILL APRIL THE 2ND WILL BE PLACED IN THIS RESERVE ACCOUNT. Also on
FidoNews 13-15 Page: 4 08 Apr 1996
future invoices we will be charging the 9.3 percent for both credit
card and check transactions plus an additional 1% that will go into
the reserve.
THIS RESERVE CAN BE REFUNDED ONE YEAR AFTER YOU STOP SUBMITTING
CHARGES TO DRAGON BUSINESS SERVICES, INC."
---------------------------------------------------------------
(capitilazation is mine for emphasis....)
I really couldn't believe it, so I called and was informed by Andy
Rose (the proprietor) that this is true.
I have submitted several hundreds of dollars to them during this
period and they are going to hold it forever. Or until one year
after I shut down the bbs.
In other words, they ain't going to pay me what they owe me.
After going to a three week payout, a NSF check for almost $300.00
(which they made good on) I don't believe I want to take a chance that
they will still be around to reimburse me several hundred dollars at
some indefinite date in the future, so I opted to part company with
them.
So:
I called Allen Cravener (author of WC-CHARGE) to ask who the "other
guys" were that were processing credit cards. He told me it is
ONLINE FINANCIAL SERVICES, INC. of Atlanta, GA.
He also said that ONLINE FINANCIAL SERVICES, INC. was formed by a
couple of sysops who became disillusioned with Dragon. Interestingly
enough, Allen no longer does business with Dragon. His charges go to
OFS. (that should tell you something right there... )
I have advised the folks who have used their credit cards on my bbs
during that period to WRITE to their credit card company and ask for
a credit because the services they purchased were not delivered.
So far the response from my users so affected has been positive, with
many going back into the charge door and subscribing again. I know I
won't get my money from the Rose family, but I feel confident that
they won't get to keep it either.
I called OFS about 5:00pm that day and talked to one of the partners
(Dan Michaels) and explained what I needed. I faxed the app shortly
thereafter. Dan called me about 15 minutes later and gave me my
client code and now I am "back in business".
OFS charges 8.5%, as opposed to Dragon's 10.3%.
Anyone interested in the OFS version of WCCHARGE can freq OFS from
1:2607/401 (Allen Cravener) or me, at 1:3801/1. It has the info pack
for Online Financial Services in it.
FidoNews 13-15 Page: 5 08 Apr 1996
Voice # at OFS is 770-476-1050 if you want to chat with them.
cheers...
Bill...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
A Few Observations On Hobby Group Dynamics
A FEW OBSERVATIONS ON HOBBY GROUP DYNAMICS
by
Kay Shapero @ 1:102/524
I published this article in FIDOnews several years ago - circumstances
suggest it might be a good idea to repeat it with a few very minor
revisions.
Recent events in Fidonet in general and FidoNews in particular suggest
the following, while originally meant for a different audience might be
of some use. Accordingly, here follows a short dissertation on
relatively small group dynamics from a somewhat anthropological view,
based on personal observations of such phenomena including various
literary fandoms, college organizations, gaming clubs, and computer
nets.
Specifically, I want to talk about what may be described as subcultures,
or hobby groups - groups of individuals bound together by a common
interest or theme, in which membership is voluntary. Such things as
chess and bridge leagues, folk dancing clubs, the Society for Creative
Anachronism, ham radio clubs or the various nets and zones of FIDOnet.
This as opposed to cultural enclaves, where members from a completely
different culture can be found living inside of the territory of another
culture but paying as little heed as possible to the imperatives of the
other culture, or ghettoization where members of a particular culture
are forced into a subculture by some characteristic or characteristics
which are seen by the larger culture as forming an obvious bond, and as
being strange at best, unsavory at worst.
Now there are all sorts of motives for joining a hobby group, but they
can be divided rather loosely into four categories
(1) intrinsic interest in the theme,
(2) social (a friend or mate is part of the group),
(3) political (membership in the group may be of help to achieve ends in
the larger culture), and sometimes
(4) out and out power seeking; the search for a small enough pond in
which one can be a large frog. Now these motives are not exclusive and
frequently members can be found who embody several of them. But one
thing seems clear - members whose motives fall entirely, or nearly
entirely into one category frequently cannot understand, or even
recognize the motives of those of another which they do not share. We
shall now explore a few of the problems this can lead to...
With any hobby group in existence for less than a decade or so, people
FidoNews 13-15 Page: 6 08 Apr 1996
primarily interested in the theme of the group predominate and include
many of the people who created the hobby group in the first place. In
the case of FIDOnet, that would be the sysops of the original net
structure, and most of the ones who have joined over the succeeding
years. If there are any recognized leaders at all, they are of the
first group, but unless there's some overwhelming reason for a rigid
formal structure, they tend to be somewhat anarchistic in nature,
especially when viewed from the outside, or by people primarily
motivated by power seeking (about which more later). Every one of the
other categories at this point has potential dangers, some more than
others.
Folks with category two motives don't tend to linger unless they also
develop motives of one or more of the other types (case in point, the
girl/boyfriend of the wargaming enthusiast who comes to a few sessions,
is bored silly, and either breaks up with the player or pries him/her
away from the game) and unless they're particularly vindictive, pose
more of a nuisance than a threat. If they are, and can't pry the
friend/mate away from the hobby, they go forth and give interviews of
the "Golf ruined my life!" variety or go on talk shows explaining why
Dungeons and Dragons is a tool of Satan. Which can do bad things to
your group's public image, which is why the smart group does not simply
ignore folks who drifted in for category two reasons; it tries to find
something to interest them instead while the primary member is doing
whatever it is the club does. If possible - in the case of something
like FIDOnet benign neglect probably IS the way to go, for anybody
further away from the social member than their local sysop.
Category three motives are relatively rare in a new group (one less than
10 or so years old, such as FIDOnet) unless the other members are
politically important already. For example, a golf club started by
professional movie makers might well attract wannabe actors; a fishing
league begun by Congressmen might attract anyone who wants to influence
one. Sometimes what the lions are famous for may be the same thing as
what the hobby group deals with, such as famous authors starting a
writing club. In any case, if the group and the fame are for two
different things, category three motives cause folks to act much like
those of category two, while if they're the same thing they may well
resemble those of category one. Herein lies the danger; in their
efforts to be noticed by the "big guns", lion hunters can do some pretty
strange things and not all realize just how far it is safe to go. So
you get the "fan from hell" syndrome, and before long all the "big guns"
may be forgiven for an assumption that the average individual who is in
the hobby purely for the fun of it must also be a "fan from hell". This
upsets no end of people, and again can really wreck the image of your
hobby group. (Comics fandom is a prime example.)
OK, here we go with category four... This motive can be of immense
value, or prove a serious nuisance. First off, people who are
attempting to find power in a small group because they cannot achieve
the power over others they desire in the outside world for reasons OTHER
than lack of competence, _and_ are interested in the intrinsic nature of
the group (category one), or are at least not bored with the topic
frequently prove serious assets to the group. Witness the caliber of
staff many a volunteer charity club has gained in the past from people
FidoNews 13-15 Page: 7 08 Apr 1996
who for reasons of sex, age, or race were actively prevented from
wielding any authority. A true benevolent dictatorship can be wonderful
for keeping the rest of the world out of the hair of the vast majority
of the club (category one) while they enjoy their hobby. After all, one
gets enough aggravation in the "real world", and despite rumor, most
folks who partake in any hobby, be it bridge, little theater, the
Society for Creative Anachronism, or FIDONet DO "have a life" besides
their favorite pastime.
The real trouble comes when you get someone who is either not QUITE
competent to run even a small group, or otherwise potentially competent,
but just plain too self centered to take into consideration the feelings
of the other members of the group. It is from THIS category that most
direct challenges to the original leadership of the hobby group tend to
come. And this confuses the heck out of the category one motivated
folks, who can't understand why this newbie seems to think that they are
running some sort of Horrible Dictatorship. It's actually fairly easy
to take the leadership away from someone who doesn't really want it in
the first place. Which means you can wind up with someone nominally in
charge who doesn't quite know what he is doing, and worse, is unaware of
this fact. This doesn't necessarily mean disaster, if the newbie is
willing to learn. If, however, he isn't, doesn't realize he simply
doesn't know everything he thinks he does, and is also of the mindset
that assumes that all people everywhere are primarily actuated by power
seeking, and that all actions must be explained in that light, Katy bar
the door! As soon as it becomes obvious that the group is not running
in the style in which either it did, or in which the category four
motivated leader WANTS it to, the search is on for the political enemy
who must be trying to take the group away from it's rightful king..er
leader. If the new leader is the only power seeker, this can damp down
pretty quickly once everyone else appoints him designated twit and
ignores him. But if there are any others about THEY will all promptly
start attempting to seize power and SAVE THE CLUB/ECHO/NET. At this
point your best bet is to sneak out the back, lock the door, tiptoe off
down the street and start a new group...
Continuing on, let us consider power struggles and power seeking in a
bit more depth. One classic way to gain power in a small group setting,
is to find one or more other people who agree with your opinions, and
start up a clique. For examples of this, consider the stereotypical
handful of highschool kids (as seen in such things as the movie
"Heathers") who set up the "in group", in which members must wear the
"right" clothes, go the "right" places, shop the "right" stores, and
think the "right" thoughts. Now most folks have a small group of
friends with whom they are comfortable and have fairly similar outlooks,
but in a classic clique, conversation among the "in group" tends to
focus on the (vital to it's existence) "out group" and why they are
"out". With one of these cliques found within a hobby group,
discussion between the core members and their hangers-on may consist
heavily of what's wrong with the hobby group, which, however it's
stated REALLY boils down to the fact that includes the "out group".
All members of the "in group" are of course constantly reinforced in
their opinions of the "out group" by sheer repetition. (You now know
why I avoid "war boards". But I digress.)
FidoNews 13-15 Page: 8 08 Apr 1996
Mind you, the opinions are not stated directly as "they're not like US",
but usually follow characteristics that exist OR ARE ASSUMED TO EXIST in
the "out group". The net result, should the clique be left alone for
awhile, can be a lot like a cyclotron - let's take an example from a
writer's club, and a clique within the club. Round one - Individual
one: "That guy puts too much sex in his stories." Individual two:
Y'know, you're right - that guy is practically writing pornography.",
"Individual three: "Yeah, I never did like that guy's writing." Wait
two days while individual one talks to individual four, individual two
talks to individual five, individual three talks to individual six.
Round two - Individual two: "That guy's latest story is a bit steamy
don't you think?" Individual four :"Yeah, I heard somewhere that he
writes pornography on the side." Individual three: "Hey, that's just
what I heard too!"
Keep this up for a few more rounds and you'll have all parties firmly
convinced that the guy in question is a professional pornographer, and
that EVERYBODY knows it.
Mind you, this can happen by accident - if someone's TRYING to do that
it can get even worse. Especially if he decides that the only way to
get control is to convince everyone else in the whole hobby that they're
all in Terrible Danger from the Outside and only following His Plans
will Save The Hobby From Destruction. And figures out the easiest way
to do this is to create rumors about the hobby group in the next
cultural group up the stack (aka "the outside world" usually, though
this phenomenon is even more concentrated in hobby subgroups - say a
local net vs FIDOnet, or a local bbs vs the local net) and about how
horrible it is because of certain factors and people, then tell everyone
to clean up their act so the outsiders will not think bad things about
them any more. Mind you, this almost never works - what this approach
usually does is, if sufficiently successful, kill off the group. I've
seen it happen.
The fact is, like it or not, there are really not that many, if any
positions of real power in FIDOnet. Essentially everything we do
depends on the willing cooperation of others. This will not change
regardless of who is theoretically "in charge". So, like the proverbial
dog who chased cars, I would suggest that the Man (or Woman) Who Would
Be King, first SERIOUSLY consider what you mean to do with your
objective if you achieve it. And remember - the more people you annoy
on the way up, the higher the probability that if you reach the top at
all, you will find that the entire pyramid has shifted out from
underneath you...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
THE Fidonet homepage
by Lee Kindness
A Comprehensive set of Fidonet WWW links
I have put together, in my opinion, the most comprehensive Fidonet
page on the web. It has a wide range of links to zone, region, net
and node hompages along with a large list of general interest Fidonet
links. The URL is:
FidoNews 13-15 Page: 9 08 Apr 1996
http://www.scms.rgu.ac.uk/students/cs_yr94/lk/fido.html
I would like to invite all those with access to give it a browse and
if you know of a page that i don't then let me know...
I also maintain hompages for:
Net 2:259 (Scotland)
The SCOTDRIVEL echo
The 259FOOTBALL echo
The FrostFree (2:250/366) points map.
And these can be accessed from the main page.
Lee Kindness, 2:259/15.46, wangi@frost3.demon.co.uk
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hello,
I read in fidonews 1314 the following:
> Seeing as how the current default gateway is going down,
> and over 90% of FidoNet will be without Internet e-mail
> service, we feel that it is time
That is so wrong. The whole zone 2 has full internet gateway
access. With true fidonet.org addresses (and not some sort of
non fidonet ones, like somegate.org).
And zone 2 is more than 50% of the total nodes. So saying that
90% of fidonet lacks gateway is definetively wrong. Maybe 90% of
zone 1, but zone 1 is not the whole fidonet, is only 40% of it
or less.
A bient<6E>t,
Pablo Saratxaga
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Routed netmail: a German point of view
Dear Don,
having read the latest editions of FidoNews, I was astonished to
find out that in America, the birthplace of FIDO, routed netmail
is no matter of course . Why that??
In Germany this is no problem: it is not only an alternative
means of communicating via FidoNet, it is also a way of keeping
echos on-topic: if you are getting off-topical the moderator
will tell you to use NM instead. In Germany we have a zonegate
(in Frankfurt/Main) which is passed by nearly all NM, so routed
NM usually takes only 2 days (on the average) to get from sender
to receiver, even if one of the two comes from outside Germany
(Austria, Switzerland take part in the German Fido conferences).
FidoNews 13-15 Page: 10 08 Apr 1996
Why do FIDO sysops not allow their users to send personal mail
in America? IMHO this is a prerequisite to keep FIDO alive! BTW:
Unlike America, FIDO is still growing a lot in Germany! Guess
why? :-) Well, what does that mean for FidoNet in America?
Establish a similar system!
Of course, America is a much larger country than Germany, but: 3
or 4 zonegates should do, shouldn't they? And the costs??? Can't
be that high!!! If a sysop gives his users acces to Usenet
newsgroups, well, that isn't cheap, either!
IMHO it can't be the costs! It's a question of mentality which,
I am absolutely sure, has to change. Maybe this letter will help
a bit!
Yours
Joerg Walther (2:2464/125.4)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
========================================================================
Fidonews Information
========================================================================
------- FIDONEWS MASTHEAD AND CONTACT INFORMATION ----------------
Editor: Donald Tees
Editors Emeritii: Thom Henderson, Dale Lovell,
Vince Perriello, Tim Pozar
Tom Jennings, Sylvia Maxwell
"FidoNews" BBS
FidoNet 1:1/23
BBS +1-519-570-4176, 300/1200/2400/14400/V.32bis/HST(DS)
more addresses:
Don -- 1:221/192, don@exlibris.tdkcs.waterloo.on.ca
(Postal Service mailing address)
FidoNews
154 Victoria St. S.
Kitchener, Ontario
Canada
N2H 2b5
voice: (519) 570-4899
Fidonews is published weekly by and for the members of the FIDONET
INTERNATIONAL AMATEUR ELECTRONIC MAIL system. It is a compilation
of individual articles contributed by their authors or their
authorized agents. The contribution of articles to this compilation
does not diminish the rights of the authors. Opinions expressed in
these articles are those of the authors and not necessarily those of
FidoNews.
FidoNews 13-15 Page: 11 08 Apr 1996
Authors retain copyright on individual works; otherwise FidoNews is
Copyright 1996 Donald Tees. All rights reserved. Duplication
and/or distribution permitted for noncommercial purposes only. For use
in other circumstances, please contact the original authors, or the eds.
OBTAINING COPIES: The most recent issue of FidoNews in electronic
form may be obtained from the FidoNews BBS via manual download or
Wazoo FileRequest, or from various sites in the FidoNet and Internet.
PRINTED COPIES may be obtained by sending SASE to the above paper-mail
address.
INTERNET USERS: FidoNews is available via FTP from ftp.fidonet.org,
in directory ~ftp/pub/fidonet/fidonews.
Anyone interested in getting a copy of the INTERNET GATEWAY FAQ may
freq GISFAQ.ZIP from 1:133/411.0, or send an internet message to
fidofaq@gisatl.fidonet.org. No message or text or subject is
necessary. The address is a keyword that will trigger the automated
response. People wishing to send inquiries directly to David Deitch
should now mail to fidonet@gisatl.fidonet.org rather than the
previously listed address.
SUBMISSIONS: You are encouraged to submit articles for publication in
FidoNews. Article submission requirements are contained in the file
ARTSPEC.DOC, available from the FidoNews BBS, or Wazoo filerequestable
from 1:1/23 as file "ARTSPEC.DOC". Please read it.
"Fido", "FidoNet" and the dog-with-diskette are U.S. registered
trademarks of Tom Jennings, and are used with permission.
' ' disgreement is actually necessary,
or we'd all have to get in fights
or semethin to amuse ourselves,,
and create the requisite chaos."
-Tom Jennings
-- END
-------------------------------------------------------------------

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