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2021-04-15 11:31:59 -07:00
85509 8-FEB 00:23 General Information
Fantasy Baseball Anyone?
From: REDCOAT To: ALL
ANNOUNCING
THE SPORTS CONNECTION ONLINE
FANTASY BASEBALL LEAGUE
Own and Manage your own team.
Draft from ALL Active Major League Players.
Play in Head-to-Head competion against other teams in the league.
Win your division and play in the SCO World Series.
Reservations are being accepted NOW! Limited Slots Available, so Reserve
your Slot Early! Drafting Begins March 5!
You can use any computer. Special software not required. The ability to use
PKUNZIP, or it's equivalent on your machine will help, but is not required.
RESERVE A TEAM NOW! LIMITED SLOTS AVAILABLE!
At you Main SIG Prompt TYPE; GO GRO SPO. At the Sports Connection Online
Main Prompt TYPE; FORUM. Once in the Forum leave a message to Don Joyce
Delphi Username REDCOAT to reserve your slot. Please include your first
and last name and your teams name.
-*-
85510 8-FEB 00:27 Programmers Den
RE: C question (Re: Msg 85495)
From: PAGAN To: JOHNREED
>Right. For "hot key" responses, your program would have a routine that
>checks the input and (hopefully) does something smart if the input char
doesn't match what is expected. My problems came from trying to port some
>messydos "C" stuff to the MM/1 and duplicate the "getch()" and "getche()"
>functions. There are lots of ways to do it -- all of them have little snags
>that have to be dealt with.
The Dec 68 Micro has an article on converting multi-byte keyboard input into
integer values that can be easily used with a lookup table. This technique
could easily be converted to duplicate the getch() and getche() functions of
turbo C for M----S.
Stephen (PAGAN)
-*-
85541 9-FEB 01:34 Programmers Den
RE: C question (Re: Msg 85470)
From: ZOGSTER To: CHYDE (NR)
> Since you want portablity you'll find that all the stdlib I/O functions
> use buffered I/O and that OS9's fix setbuf() is not available for other
> OS's. Use of system calls does not necessarily mean non-compatiblity
> however, it depends on the systems you're porting to. You can try an
> old trick if you'd like for your hot keys, rather than use the read()
> call try the follwoing function:
>
> int hot(char *ans)
> {
> read(0,ans,1);
> return ans;
> } /* oops the function declaration should be char *hot(...) */
>
> Then for each port you will only have to rewrite (maybe) this function.
>
> I've done this with several Unix programs and GNU does it regularly, just
> a thought.
Thanks for the information. I saved a copy of this message for my future
referance.
Jim
-*-
85542 9-FEB 01:35 Programmers Den
RE: C question (Re: Msg 85471)
From: ZOGSTER To: JEJONES
> > Isn't '\0' a NULL in standard C?
>
> '\0' is a character constant. In standard C, it has type int (weird, eh?);
> in C++ it has type char. Its value is zero.
>
> What the ANSI C standard says is that *if you cast 0 to a pointer type*,
> the result will be a null pointer. There are, in fact, systems in which
> the null pointer does not have all bits zero, so it does make a difference.
> In ANSI C, you can get away with passing 0 to a function expecting a pointer
> IF a prototype is visible at the call, because then the implicit cast will
> occur. If a prototype is *not* visible, then you're taking a chance.
> On some systems, you'll luck out, and on some, you won't.
>
> In pre-ANSI C, there are no prototypes, so you're taking a chance if you
> pass the integer 0 to a function expecting to see a pointer and hoping that
> the called function will get a null pointer.
Thanks for the info. C is a very interesting language to be sure.
Jim
-*-
85543 9-FEB 01:35 Programmers Den
RE: C question (Re: Msg 85473)
From: ZOGSTER To: COLORSYSTEMS
> I think read() and write() are going to be part of the standard in C++,
> at any rate, most of the code I write depends on support from KWindows
> and is therefore not very portable to begin with. Top that with every
> system I've ever used a C compiler on HAD read() and write() type calls
> and they worked the same as they did here on OS-9.
>
> I figure if I want to port some of my code over to some OS which doesn't
> have read() and write(), well that's what conditional compilation is all
> about! <grin>
Thanks for the reply. Since most operating systems have similar
system calls I may not have the problems that I can invision.
Jim
-*-
85546 9-FEB 01:36 Programmers Den
RE: C question (Re: Msg 85495)
From: ZOGSTER To: JOHNREED
> Right. For "hot key" responses, your program would
> have a routine that checks the input and (hopefully)
> does something smart if the input char doesn't match
> what is expected. My problems came from trying to
> port some messydos "C" stuff to the MM/1 and duplicate
> the "getch()" and "getche()" functions. There are
> lots of ways to do it -- all of them have little snags
> that have to be dealt with.
I had the same problems with converting an MS-Dog program
that had "getche()" functions. I converted them to
getchar() and then discovered buffered input.
Jim
-*-
End of Thread.
-*-
85511 8-FEB 00:28 General Information
RE: Microware in the WSJ (Re: Msg 85461)
From: PAGAN To: CBJ
>In the MS-Dog world it is common to buy machines that have the DOS installed
>as well a Windows and a menuing program that will allow you the options of
>running Windows or the various MS-Dog programs that may have been bundled
>with the machine. There is also the option of going to the MS-Shell program
>and using the mouse that is invariably included with the machine. If you
>don't ever want to see a command line prompt or learn anything about the DOS
>it is very easy and you don't have to be limited to just a few programs that
>are included either. You can launch the install programs from Windows and
>just allow the program to set itself up with answering a few simple
>questions such as does this screen come up in color? This is what OS-9 has
>been unable to provide for the users. It isn't a fault of the Operating
>system nor is it impossible for us to achieve. It just takes work and the
>willingness to do it that way. I for one would love to be able to install
>new programs without always having to create new directories and typing a
>lot of commands.
Don't judge OS9 by your experience with the COCO 6809 version. When the
COCO III and level II were new things weren't much better in the MS-DOS
world.
Many OSK machines come with the opsys installed - my Sys IV did. OSK has
some features that make it easier to use and some developers are including
install and setup programs with their software. I have one of each with
DataDex and G-Windows has a pretty good install utility.
Stephen (PAGAN)
-*-
85512 8-FEB 00:29 General Information
RE: Microware in the WSJ (Re: Msg 85489)
From: PAGAN To: TOMFANN
>I don't think we disagree at all - we are saying the same thing. Of course
>OS9 can be set up easy to use, but someone has to do that, and in order to
>do that, one must have some understanding of the operating system. In the
>CoCo world, the end user (the purchaser of the software) is the one who has
>to know his way around OS9. The reason why OS9 got its reputation is
>simple. Under RS-DOS, if you buy, say, CoCoMax 3, to get it up and running
>all you have to do is put the disk in the drive and type "Run CM3". Anyone
>can do that. But to get MVCanvas up and running, you must "install" the
>program and that demands a certain amount of know-how. A lot of people just
>didn't want to go to that much trouble, which is too bad.
Having installed MVCanvas I know what you mean <g>. It would have been nice
if the author had included an installation program but, remember, we're
talking about level II for the COCO. It may seem a bit odd but. IMO, it
would have been much harder to write a decent interactive install program
for COCO level II because of the wide variation in hardware. On an OSK
system (and M----S) I can assume that the user is going to run the softwre
from a hard drive.
Note, I'm not saying that it can't be done for level II but it would be
difficult. For OSK systems it's easy enough that there is no real good
excuse for not having a (reasonably) flexible installation utility. When
someone spends several hundred hours developing a solid application another
few spent writing an install program is trivial.
>I played with Windows for the first time today on my wife's Compac 486 in
>her office. You can say what you want about Multi-Vue, but I will take it
>any day over Windows running on the fastest PC around.
Wait until you see G-Windows. The new version (2.5) has some _really_ neat
features.
Stephen (PAGAN)
-*-
85515 8-FEB 06:26 General Information
RE: Microware in the WSJ (Re: Msg 85512)
From: TOMFANN To: PAGAN
I will never see G-Windows, because I have no plans to buy an MM/1 or
anything else running OSK. A CoCo 3 does all I need, and more, for the
present and foreseeable future.
..Tom Fann
-*-
85519 8-FEB 15:40 General Information
RE: Microware in the WSJ (Re: Msg 85511)
From: CBJ To: PAGAN
It is true that some systems come with the Opsys installed BUT and this is the
big but as far as I'm concerned, the type of software that has the install
utilities that you describe are few and far between and most are expensive. It
is a standard for shareware and PD programs to even include install utilities
that are extremely easy to use. All I'm saying is that it can be done under
OS9 as well and IF we want to draw personal users from the MS-Dos areas we are
going to have to be offering a system that is as easy to "break into" for a
neophyte. I understand that OS9 6809 is outdated but I've worked with OSK and
OS-9000 as well. I also use MS-DOS daily as well as windows. I haven't seen
a command line on the MS-DOS machines at work for so long that I can't remember
what the prompt is anymore. Mostly I am using custom made programs to boot and
EVERY one of them had an install program to launch it from. Ah, what the heck,
you know and I know that the real power lies at the command line prompt BUT I
still say that most home users (or for that matter professional users) don't
need or want that type of power. They ant an appliance that takes no more
brain poer to use than an ordinary clothes dryer.
Carl
P. S. and if the dryer has a glass door they will probably sit in front of it
and atch the clothes go around.
-*-
85520 8-FEB 15:43 General Information
RE: Microware in the WSJ (Re: Msg 85512)
From: CBJ To: PAGAN
Actually I can see no good reason why an install program would be any harder to
write for the CoCo. Just because it may need to be run from hard disk is no
reason. You can have a floppy based OSK system as well.
Carl
-*-
85531 8-FEB 22:25 General Information
RE: Microware in the WSJ (Re: Msg 85511)
From: THETAURUS To: PAGAN
I agree, comparing Level II with the Dos machines sold today is a
big no-no. It is almost an apples&oranges case. What I don't
understand is why anyone, especially a programmer who writes a BIG
application<or as big as big can get in this market right now>, can't
write an install program. From what I gather, that is starting to
change with some of the OSK apps coming out, like you said. The thing
is, even on the Coco it should be just as easy writing an install
procedure in Basic or what ever language of your choice, that makes it
friendly.
I think the biggest problem is, there are very few standard
directories. We have SYS, which many programmers will use to put
environment files and such, and then of course CMDS, and to a lesser
degree DATA. I say 'to a lesser degree' because I think people each
have different uses for the Data dir. But the problem is, what if the
install program only assumes those dirs, and the user has another way
he wants them installed? For instance, right now my HD setup is back
to being very basic, with just about ALL executables being in CMDS.
Personally I HATE this arrangement, as I would rather spread my stuff
out and organize them more, like I used to have them<Basic,C,Asm, and
Pascal compilor executables being in the cmds dir of the PROG
directory,etc>, but I eventually ran into trouble with programs
looking for utilities, which were in /dd/cmds, while my current exec
dir would be set to lets say, /dd/prog/cmds/Basic or something like
that. Personally I think ONLY utilities and maybe a few other small
execs should be in /dd/cmds, with applications being able to reside in
whatever directory the user wants. Once I get a new pritnter to print
out the HDO docs, I'm gonna try out HDO<Hard Disk Organizer> and see
if that can do the trick. It looks like and interesting piece of work,
and the author seems to have the right idea. Anyhow, back to how this
relates to install procedures.
My idea of a good install procedure is one that will pop up a
menu, and also ask you if you would like to procede with the default
installation. If the user hits N, then he/she is at the menu which
will allow them to change maybe a few details of the procedure
including where each file will go to. The default for instance would
send all command files to /dd/cmds and the environment file(s) if any
to /dd/sys as well as other files to such directories as Data and/or
maybe DOCS<which is on my hd, tho isn't a standard> and whatever else
the programmer decides to put in. If the user knows enough about where
he wants his files to go he can then select in a couple ways how to
get them there. He could simply say, all command files go to
/dd/WP/CMDS and the data files go to /DD/APP/WP/DATA or what have you,
or he could designate a destination for each file. It should be real
functional, yet shouldn't NEED to be flashy at all. Boy I sure am
ramblin' on tonight<Grin>.
I jumped into this, because I am going to start working with my
HD and try again to spread things out. I have a good deal more
experience now with the OS now then I did when I first ran into these
problems, and it will be an adventure learning what causes what
problem and how to fix it and get things working right on the hd, with
the files set up in a way I am comfortable with. Plus I would love to
write an article, and having something that I will have knowledge
about sure will help<Grin>
See Ya
>Chris<
-*-
85535 8-FEB 23:18 General Information
RE: Microware in the WSJ (Re: Msg 85531)
From: RICKULAND To: THETAURUS
OS9 assumes (you've seen Tony Randall draw that out on a blackboard, I bet)
that 'it's' directories (/dd/cmds and /dd/sys) are laid out like IT wants-
including subdirs like /dd/cmds/icon and /dd/sys/dial.
These ought to be invisible to the user. With a proper cmds dir chx can
be
omitted- I suspect it's there for floppy compataqability.
These dirs are so embedded in OS9's way of thinking that almost every pr
ogram
expects to find any exzxecutable at any time, in /dd/cmds. It would be hard to
get a simple program to work 'against the grain' and reliably
operate on some other concept- that would be a new operating system!
-ricku
-*-
85547 9-FEB 03:10 General Information
RE: Microware in the WSJ (Re: Msg 85531)
From: PAGAN To: THETAURUS
>I agree, comparing Level II with the Dos machines sold today is a big no-no.
>It is almost an apples&oranges case.
No "almost" about it! Comparing the 6809 to any of the various '486
machines is ludicrous. The 6809 is _clearly_ the superior processor - just
not as fast <g>.
>...even on the Coco it should be just as easy writing an install procedure
>in Basic or what ever language of your choice, that makes it friendly.
I thought about it some more after I posted last night's messages. Maybe if
two types of operation were considered "default" - dual floppy and hard
drive - it might work. Still, with multiple windows vis a vis floppy
operation, it becomes a problem solvalble only in exponential time <g>.
Let's face it, level II for the COCO was designed around a floppy system but
OS9 is too powerful to be easily restrained to one.
>I think the biggest problem is, there are very few standard directories. We
>have SYS, which many programmers will use to put environment files and such,
>and then of course CMDS, and to a lesser degree DATA. ...what if the
>install program only assumes those dirs, and the user has another way he
>wants them installed?
First, the install program shouldn't assume that the user wants all
executables in CMDS and all env file in SYS. They may be defaults but some
flexibility is demanded. Maybe checking the PATH variable and asking which
directory the user wants or asking where the data files are to be stored and
updating the user's .login file to set the appropriate environment
variables.
Total flexibility in an install, however, is useless. Most users will
accept the defaults so offering too much will just confuse them and defeat
the purpose. If the user wants something not covered then make certain the
docs provide enough info for them to do it "the hard way".
>Personally I think ONLY utilities and maybe a few other small execs should
>be in /dd/cmds, with applications being able to reside in whatever directory
>the user wants.
With OSK the PATH environment variable let's you do just that. For example,
I keep stuff I may use from anywhere in /dd/CMDS or in /dd/GWINDOWS/CMDS
but programs that are 'directory specific' are in that directory. I define
my PATH in .login as:
setenv PATH .:/dd/GWINDOWS/CMDS
The trouble with level II is it was intended for floppy based operation and
doesn't have some of the features (like PATH) that make hard drive operation
easier.
>My idea of a good install procedure is one that will pop up a menu, and also
>ask you if you would like to procede with the default installation. If the
>user hits N, then he/she is at the menu which will allow them to change
>maybe a few details of the procedure including where each file will go to.
Pretty much my thoughts on the subject. Just remember that most users are
lazy and will accept the default. Don't get too flashy or you confuse
them. Better to make it easy for the 99% and leave the 1% of brute force
types to read the documentation <g>.
Stephen (PAGAN)
-*-
End of Thread.
-*-
85513 8-FEB 02:53 OSK Applications
RE: Makpal_fix (Re: Msg 85458)
From: LARRYOLSON To: WTHOMPSON (NR)
Wayne,
The problem is, where can a person find the information/specifications
for IFF files. This would include both picture and sound IFF's.
I just downloaded 3 files from the Amiga sig on CIS, with IFF as one of
the keywords in the description, but the version of Iffshow that I have
says that these are not picture files, even though that is what they were
called in the description. I could not find any spec file on IFF's in any
of the Amiga sig's. Was it a particular company that came up with IFF, and
if so, what company ?
Excuse me for ranting. Its not aimed at you. I just hope that someone
with the information will jump in here.
larry
-*-
85526 8-FEB 21:12 OSK Applications
RE: Makpal_fix (Re: Msg 85513)
From: BANANAMAN To: LARRYOLSON
Hi, Larry. You might want to check out the SOX archive in the databases here.
It has code in it which describes many different sound file formats.
--Andy
-*-
85566 10-FEB 05:01 OSK Applications
RE: Makpal_fix (Re: Msg 85526)
From: LARRYOLSON To: BANANAMAN
Yes, I have that file.
larry
-*-
End of Thread.
-*-
85514 8-FEB 05:45 General Information
RE: MM/1 GWindows (Re: Msg 84801)
From: EDELMAR To: KSCALES
Ken,
First to clarify things, I had previously said "that G-WINDOWS proper (WFM)
doesn't use any keyboard input. It responds to the mouse, command line inputs
and software control." The second sentance is true but the first one isn't.
There are several features I use so much, I forget WFM supports them. WFM
expands on the command line editing of SCF. It permits you to edit a command
line allowing insertion/deletion of characters; the cursor is positioned
by means of the arrow keys. WFM maintains a list of the last 50 commands.
These are displayed by means of the up/down arrow keys. Clicking the left
mouse button can be simulated by means of the <alt> space key. The arrow
keys also move the mouse cursor 1 pixel at a time. When an application is
being run, WFM passes the codes to application and does not process them.
WFM will permit the user to remap the arrow keys, the BS key and the key
used to simulate clicking the left mouse button. But G-WINDOWS does not
require remapping of any keys.
Two apps distributed with G-WINDOWS do use some of the keys reserved by
K-Windows. DESKTOP uses an extensive menuing system to select various
tasks. Some of the menu items may be selected by using control keys. These
are 'short-cut' selections. The second application is G-VIEW. Wedit, the
main program, uses menus as above as well as the 'short-cut' control key
combinations. These keys include <control> a, b, c, d, etc. (most of the
alphabet). These are hard-coded in the above apps.
G-WINDOWS apps may, at the programmers discretion, use keyboard input, mouse,
touch screen, X-Y pad and/or any combination of these. Of course, an app
might want to remap a key(s). This is no different than any software written
for OS-9/OS-9000.
Let me cite example - doesn't involve G-WINDOWS but it does involve the way
the keys are handled by K-Windows. A program I sell, QuickEd, uses the F(n)
keys from F1 to F10 to permit performing certain functions. QuickEd includes
an environment file which also permits the F(n) keys may be redefined to be
any key the user wishes. But the docs and help files refer to F(n) keys.
Can get confusing and did to several customers who had MM/1s.
Another example - the following might represent a menu an app written under
G-WINDOWS might use -
<q> Quit
<s> Do something
F10 Do something else
Alt-F6 Do a fourth thing
<z> Do a fifth thing
etc.
The user may use his mouse to select the activity. Alternately, if there is
a key associated with it, the key and/or key sequence specified may be used
without calling the menu. (Under G-WINDOWS convention, the use of < >
indicates a control character.)
Control keys are standardized and there is no need to define them. However,
other keys, such as the F10 or ALT-F6 I show above are not. (Incidently, I
took the ALT-F6 combination from AVAGIO, a reasonably popular, low cost DTP
package for MSDOS. It is similar to PageMaker. They use many ALT-key
combinations as well as CNTRL-key combos.)
You made mention of window moving and resizing. I assume you are actually
referring to what I'd call a screen so hereafter I'll use the term 'screen'
to define the entire display and 'window' as used with G-WINDOWS; i.e.,
that portion of the screen being used by a process. A screen is simply a
block of memory of a defined size and starting address. It is possible to
write the driver so the starting address can be changed on the fly. But
WFM expects the amount of memory available (height * width) to remain
constant. (I have no control over that module.) Consider the following -
the size of the G-WINDOWS screen is resized downward. K-Windows will think
that memory is now available and can use it. (Don't know if this would be
true in all cases but it would seem to be true if the G-WINDOWS screen is the
last screen.) Now start a new screen and run a process. Flip back to the
G-WINDOWS screen. WFM, not knowing it has lost some memory, will simply
overwrite the new screen. If you flip back to the new screen, you'll
probably have garbage. I realize there are calls under K-Windows that can do
the same thing and I'll have no control over these. But at least I can
minimize the problems and try to prevent the user from inadvertantly resizing
a G-WINDOWS screen from the keyboard when he is in the G-WINDOWS screen.
I'm not anxious to write any code not necessary. K-Windows places restric-
tions on the use of certain keys - that's OK - that is part of the rules of
K-Windows and all programmers know these rules. But consider this - G-WINDOWS
does not restrict the use of any keys; programmers are at liberty to use any
key or key combination they wish. Many G-WINDOWS programmers will not be
aware that certain hardware has placed restrictions on the use of certain
keys/key combinations. My view is that a port of G-WINDOWS to the MM/1 (or
any other hardware) should conform to and allow full G-WINDOWS capabilities
without any restrictions.
Ed
-*-
85516 8-FEB 06:46 General Information
RE: RLL and MFM controllers for SALE (Re: Msg 85431)
From: TOMFANN To: COCOKIWI
Are these new controllers or pulls?
..Tom Fann
-*-
85538 9-FEB 00:29 General Information
RE: RLL and MFM controllers for SALE (Re: Msg 85516)
From: COCOKIWI To: TOMFANN (NR)
I have no idea....the place is a surplus dealer.....they also deal with
OEM....could be new! sometimes someone finds a pile in the corner that got
missed...<grin>and sells them to a Surplus dealer for cents on the doller!
Dennis
-*-
End of Thread.
-*-
85517 8-FEB 06:55 General Information
RE: DISTO Products running Low. (Re: Msg 85454)
From: TOMFANN To: COCOKIWI
Is the parallel port on the 4N1 useable with RS-DOS programs? That is,
would, say, Telewriter recognize it? Or is a special driver under OS9
required?
..Tom Fann
-*-
85525 8-FEB 21:03 General Information
RE: DISTO Products running Low. (Re: Msg 85446)
From: DISTO To: DENNYWRIGHT
My eprom burner goes for $50 but requires my SCI or SCII controller to work.
The 2-Meg adapter is a kit that you solder into your COCO 3. It allows you to
use two 1-Meg SIMMs to give you 2 megs of memory for OS9. The 4IN1 is an
adapter that plugs into my SCII and has 4 ports in 1. They are parallel port,
true RS232 serial port, a real time clock and a SCSI hard disk port. -Tony.
-*-
85539 9-FEB 00:32 General Information
RE: DISTO Products running Low. (Re: Msg 85517)
From: COCOKIWI To: TOMFANN (NR)
as far as I know YES! ART,S ADOS-3 Ext... will...and there is a program that
come with it!that redirects the printer output<ART,s is built in>
Dennis
-*-
85551 9-FEB 19:14 General Information
RE: DISTO Products running Low. (Re: Msg 85525)
From: DENNYWRIGHT To: DISTO (NR)
I have a SC II how much is a 4in1 board. I have a SCSI hard drive but it's on
the blink. I use a Ken-Ton interface and an adaptec 4000A controller. The drive
is mfm. I'd like to get a 2 meg upgrade and an eprom burner. Actually I'd
like
to get everything
but I don't think I have the $ right now.
-*-
85563 10-FEB 01:10 General Information
RE: DISTO Products running Low. (Re: Msg 85439)
From: ROYBUR To: DISTO (NR)
what's the going price for a coco 3, tony? 8*).........roy
-*-
End of Thread.
-*-
85518 8-FEB 07:57 General Information
RE: Cron (Re: Msg 85433)
From: MARKGRIFFITH To: TEDJAEGER
Ted,
> Thanks for the info Mark! Looks like a line of text got deleted from
> your response. I got "file must be called crontab and placed in the ..."
> You were gonna tell me the name of the directory but it got zapped
> somehow. So, if you could, one more time!
It goes in /dd/sys. Let me know if you need more help.
/************* /\/\ark ************/
(uploaded with InfoXpress Ver 1.01)
-*-
85521 8-FEB 18:53 OSK Applications
Model RR CAD Program?
From: RHELLER To: ALL
I am looking for a freeware or PD CAD program. It needs to meet these
conditions:
1) come with source code (C or C++)
2) run under OS9 w/X11R4 (Xaw or Motif)
(a vanila UNIX program will do -- OS-9 is much like UNIX)
3) have hooks for a backend to generate data files for other systems
4) have the ablity to generate hard-copy plots on a BJ330 printer
(Epson 24-pin (LQ) compatable).
Does such a beast exist? If so where?
I am mainly interested in such a program for model railroad layout
design, but have other uses in mind, if the program is a general
purpose CAD program. I really don't need something has fancy as
AutoCAD -- just something simple and basic (and that will run on my 68K
based OS-9/68000 system).
Reply here or send E-Mail to:
RHELLER (Delphi)
Robert Heller at 1:321/153 (FidoNet)
heller@cs.umass.edu (InterNet)
locks.hill.bbs on BIX (BIX)
-*-
85522 8-FEB 19:01 General Information
RE: Hard Drives (Re: Msg 85506)
From: JRUPPEL To: THETAURUS
Thanks, Chris. Boisy had the address for Ken-Ton (posted here). Now I can TRY
to make a choice <G>. Both units are highly recommended by those that use them.
John
-*-
85524 8-FEB 19:21 General Information
RE: Hard Drives (Re: Msg 85497)
From: DENNYWRIGHT To: BOISY
Oh well that's a bummer. He's only had the drive a month! That's his next step.
Another member of our club is going to test it on an IBM machine. Thanks for
the help though. PS I HATE DELHI MESSAGE EDITOR! How do you send normal
messages that look formatte
d correctly?
-*-
85556 9-FEB 20:52 General Information
RE: Hard Drives (Re: Msg 85524)
From: DSRTFOX To: DENNYWRIGHT
You type them VERY CAREFULLY the first time around! (or, as some do, off-line)
Try low-level formatting on the DOS machine... but there should be a way to
low-level format under DECB or OS-9...
-*-
End of Thread.
-*-
85523 8-FEB 19:18 General Information
RE: B&B (Re: Msg 85496)
From: DENNYWRIGHT To: DSRTFOX
I'm afraid that OS9 format ends with error 240 and RSDOS fornmat yeilds io
error.
Attempts to load RGB-DOS end with the drive light on and flikering while the
drive steps continuously but I don't get a prompt back. The computer just sits
there with the green screen message.
-*-
85554 9-FEB 20:48 General Information
RE: B&B (Re: Msg 85523)
From: DSRTFOX To: DENNYWRIGHT
If this were an MS-DOS system, I'd say the drive needs to be low-level
formatted, not DOS formatted. I have no idea how that is accomplished under
DECB or OS-9- someone here SHOULD be able to help. But that also means
EVERYTHING
on the hard drive is lost!!
-*-
85571 10-FEB 22:05 General Information
RE: B&B (Re: Msg 85554)
From: DENNYWRIGHT To: DSRTFOX (NR)
Apparently his problem has corrected itself! He thinks it may be a bad cable
causing the problem now. Thanks anyway.
-*-
End of Thread.
-*-
85527 8-FEB 21:19 General Information
60' Micros
From: FHOGG To: DSRTFOX
Got mine today, copy that is, of 60' micros.
Frank
-*-
85555 9-FEB 20:50 General Information
RE: 60' Micros (Re: Msg 85527)
From: DSRTFOX To: FHOGG
You must have been one of the LAST people to get one! Most arrived during the
first week of FEB, but the 8th is still in line with expectations.
-*-
85565 10-FEB 02:31 General Information
RE: 60' Micros (Re: Msg 85555)
From: ROYBUR To: DSRTFOX
i'm still waiting for my copy, frank. i have this idea that WV isn't high on
the USnail list of priorities. 8*)..........roy
-*-
85570 10-FEB 21:16 General Information
RE: 60' Micros (Re: Msg 85565)
From: DSRTFOX To: ROYBUR (NR)
WV was in a multi-state package. If it doesn't get there by Monday, let me know
and I'll get another out. The US Mail ALWAYS loses one or two even first
class...
-*-
End of Thread.
-*-
85528 8-FEB 22:00 General Information
RE: No 40 column screen (Re: Msg 85502)
From: RICKULAND To: NEALSTEWARD
Butting my nose in where it don't belong..... I've been banging
on my 2meg for close to a year. It doesn't complain, ever. Especially
when run in 512K mode, which is where it start before mega2 or boot mods.
Perhaps the old GIME is losing a register byte or 2? Worth the
alcohol swab fix anyway. RAM test still check? how about at double spped?
-ricku
-*-
85533 8-FEB 22:49 General Information
RE: No 40 column screen (Re: Msg 85528)
From: NEALSTEWARD To: RICKULAND
Please butt in... I just tried cleaning the contacts, but it still does
it. It did clear up some of the "sparklies" that I was getting. You
may have hit the nail on the head when you said "old GIME", it is a
1986 version. I wonder if that has anything to do with it. Other
symtoms are gshell writes misc. characters all over the screen in
several windows, especially Presto Partner. Ever encounter anything
like this? Thanks for the input. I'll run a RAM test and see if
that shows anything.
-*-
85536 8-FEB 23:30 General Information
RE: No 40 column screen (Re: Msg 85533)
From: RICKULAND To: NEALSTEWARD (NR)
The thing I keep in mind is this- a GIME has somewhat more curcuitry included
than the
rest of the motherboard. Beyond that, it's one of the few cmos chips on
the motherboard, even the cpu is nmos. Ask 6309 owners about cmos- where a 6809
sometimes blows, a 6309 _always_ pops. They are touchy devices. As made, the 86
gimes on suffer from the sparklies as far as I know,
but any edition gime is the most fragile chip on the board. When some gime
related
function like a single window mode starts acting up, I tend to gravitate to
testing
that chip and it's contacts. (I'm usually right).
-ricku
-*-
End of Thread.
-*-
85529 8-FEB 22:13 General Information
RE: Printer (Re: Msg 85505)
From: RICKULAND To: THETAURUS
This is scary simple. All 74ls chips are numbered down the left, then up
the
right (if notch is on top). The very last pin (thats just right of notch or
opposite
dotted pin) is 5v. Conect this point to the same place on one of the 74ls chips
inside the blue streak. You can pick anything, but since the steak is plugged
into the CoCo, I'd use it for power over mpi of drive case.
Some printers get dang nsty and ground their input pin 18, which is wher
e the
power is supposed
to come from. Watch for that- if the combination comes up black screen rip that
power pin
out by the roots (all you can do on a Blue Streak) and live happy ever after.
(Note: I am a fun loving kinda guy, and play fast and loose with my own
hardware.
You might not want to live as dangerous.)
-ricku
-*-
85530 8-FEB 22:20 General Information
RE: Message Formatting... (Re: Msg 85508)
From: RICKULAND To: MITHELEN
I don't get on here much anymore, but noticed the same thing. I hope this means
vms mail is being replaced with something that works a little better for
commercial BBS use.
I suspect it means the auto format was screwing up tons of internet mail and
they switched it out.
-ricku
-*-
85537 9-FEB 00:23 General Information
RE: Message Formatting... (Re: Msg 85530)
From: MITHELEN To: RICKULAND
Actually, Forum has NOTHING to do with VMS Mail... (I actually LIKE mail
here on DElphi, because it IS TRUE VMS mail) MAil here never had the formatting
done to it though... I haven't jumped into any of the other Sigs that have
Usenet groups available in them, are they "Gatewaying" the Usenet Groups
to basically the same softare that runs Forum i nthe Sigs? Or is it a completely
different interface? I just might have to check out for myself tonight...
--
Paul Jerkatis - SandV BBS (708)352-0948: Chicago Area OS-9 Users Group
UUCP: amiserv.xnet.com!vpnet!sandv!mithelen ...or... mithelen@sandv.chi.il.us
Internet: MITHELEN@Delphi.com
"Did you ever notice how cheep 99% of all BBS users are?" - Unknown
-*-
85540 9-FEB 01:25 General Information
RE: Message Formatting... (Re: Msg 85537)
From: RICKULAND To: MITHELEN
I really can't say. But have had Delphi clobber my messages so often it's kind
of refreshing to see them left alone. I might try actual formatted (space and
cr) ascii again:-)
-ricku
PS Is it me, or did my tabs just work?
-*-
End of Thread.
-*-
85532 8-FEB 22:25 Programmers Den
OSK and Graphics
From: THETAURUS To: ALL
I have a question for OSK users/programmers. I know that without
X,K,or G Windows, or whatever of windowing systems exist for OSk, that
you are in a Windowless environment. Now, what about Graphics in
general? Does Professional OS9 and OS-9000 itself come with any
graphics capabilities for users who don't want a windowing package. To
make an analogy<and this isn't one I like to use often>, With Dos, you
may or may not get Windows with the system, but even if you don't you
can still write graphics based programs. Is there a CGFX.l like
library with C or a similar source for ASM that will allow graphics
programming on a non Window based system. I know Dos is probably a bad
example since the windows and multitasking both come with the Windows
package while OS9 itself is a multitasking system, but I think it
isn't so bad in this case where we are just talking graphics
programming ability. I know there is or will be BGFX again for Basic,
but is that just MM/1 or Kwindows specific? I thought of this because
a lot of the machine specific or non window software I hear of for OSK
in Termcap based with no graphics.
Please, someone straighten me out on this :-)
>Chris<
-*-
85534 8-FEB 22:56 System Modules (6809)
SCII drivers
From: NEALSTEWARD To: DISTO (NR)
Are there other versions of the drivers for the Super Controller II
available? The reason I ask is when I run B&B's tuneup command to
powerboost my system for the 6309, it reports that it can't match the
SCII modules. I use the .slp versions because I've had no luck with
boots using the .irq versions.
-*-
85544 9-FEB 01:35 General Information
RE: UltiMuse 4.9 w/NitrOs9 (Re: Msg 85474)
From: ZOGSTER To: DSRTFOX
> Well Jim, will get you on the list and send you a copy of the next issue out,
> which will be 15 March.
Thanks Frank.
Jim
-*-
85545 9-FEB 01:36 General Information
RE: Wish list (latest) (Re: Msg 85475)
From: ZOGSTER To: JOEGERBER
> Send internet mail to listserv@pucc.bitnet. Put as the body of the msg:
>
> SUB COCO <name>
>
> Note the use of capital letters--very important!
actually case doesn't matter, here's how I subscribed:
send email to listserv@pucc.princeton.edu
the first line of the body of the email was:
subscribe CoCo "Jim Vestal"
This works for me.
Jim
-*-
85549 9-FEB 06:59 General Information
RE: Wish list (latest) (Re: Msg 85499)
From: MROWEN01 To: SCWEGERT (NR)
I read your note regarding the Internet COCO list server. You described how
to be added to the list, bit what do you do to remove yourself from the list?
I'm interested in chyecking it out, but I don't want to keep it if it over-
loads my mail queue. (I'm wanting to use my work internet address).
-Thanks
-*-
85550 9-FEB 19:12 General Information
RE: Wish list (latest) (Re: Msg 85545)
From: JOEGERBER To: ZOGSTER
For me, if I ever forget caps, Listserv bounces my msg right back. BTW, I used
the .bitnet extension because when I was in college, eons ago,
pucc.princton.edu didn't register as a valid Internet address--I guess old
habits are hard to bre
ak:-)
Joe
-*-
End of Thread.
-*-
85548 9-FEB 04:53 General Information
bible database
From: DANBEACH To: ALL
the dsrtfox tells me there is a 0s9 based bible database, or
concordance someone has. I would like to find it. if you know about it and
where I can get one, please leave E-mail for
danbeach. thank you very much.
-dan-
-*-
85552 9-FEB 20:26 OSK Applications
gnuchess
From: WRHAMBLEN To: ALL
Well, Ed Gresick tells me that gnuchess misbehaves when running under
G-Windows. It doesn't crash, but it does not display correctly and the
quit comment doesn't behave well. G-Windows uses VT100 style display codes,
which are popular in the GNU universe, but might not sit well with the
TOPS curses package. In any case, I'm doing some more testing unless some
angel has aready figured it out and want to share the secret.
Bud
-*-
85553 9-FEB 20:46 General Information
RE: 268'm (Re: Msg 85500)
From: DSRTFOX To: NEALSTEWARD (NR)
Everyone seems to have received their issue during the estimated time span
(about 5-7 days). So far so good! The only thing I have reservations about now
is during the holiday season (Christmas)! But I always have my Christmas
shopping issue in Nov., so shouldn't be a real problem.
-*-
85557 9-FEB 21:11 OSK Applications
SC
From: MRGOOD To: MITHELEN
Paul,
I tried out the version of SC you emailed to me. It definitely
handles the screen faster. Unfortunately, it doesn't load
any of my spreadsheets made with version 6.16. Oh well....
Thanks anyway!
Hugo
-*-
85558 9-FEB 22:30 OSK Applications
RE: SC (Re: Msg 85557)
From: MITHELEN To: MRGOOD
When I get my Sun all settled in as the SandV BBS, I'll have some time
to start playing on the MM/1 more.... I'll try to compile sc 6.16 (or, if I
find a newer version I'll use that) using the EFFO curses lib...
Z
-*-
85559 9-FEB 23:18 OSK Applications
RE: SC (Re: Msg 85558)
From: KSCALES To: MITHELEN
> When I get my Sun all settled in as the SandV BBS, I'll have some time
> to start playing on the MM/1 more.... I'll try to compile sc 6.16 (or, if I
> find a newer version I'll use that) using the EFFO curses lib...
Paul, last time I looked, 'sc' was up to version 6.21. I've got the
source here, and had been planning to do an updated port (using the EFFO
curses this time) once I wrapped up my current projects. Rather than
duplicating effort, let's make sure that if one of us starts working on
it, he lets the other know ;-)
Cheers... / Ken
(The changes from 6.16 to 6.21 don't seem very major... Considering I
did my earlier port on a 1-meg, floppy-based MM/1, this should be
interesting. A full re-compile used to take about 2.5 hours.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ken Scales Delphi:KSCALES Internet:kscales@delphi.com CIS:74646,2237
-*-
85560 9-FEB 23:51 OSK Applications
RE: SC (Re: Msg 85558)
From: WA2EGP To: MITHELEN
As I said in email, my copy works (sort of) on the old machine. I think I will
have to mess with the termcap file for my particular terminal....especially
since I will have some "uninitiated" users entering data ;->
-*-
85564 10-FEB 01:11 OSK Applications
RE: SC (Re: Msg 85559)
From: MITHELEN To: KSCALES
Ok Ken... I'll let you take of the update then... And I'll concentrate my
efforts on something else...
--
Paul
-*-
85567 10-FEB 05:29 OSK Applications
RE: SC (Re: Msg 85559)
From: BROWN80 To: KSCALES
Is there a version out that uses termcap rather than terminfo. The vt100
terminfo file doesn't work very well with G-Windows ( I have to redraw the
screen a lot). I think it's because there are some vt52 controls mixed into
the G-Windows description. I don't know how to come up with a custom terminfo
file for G-Windows. I'm going try one more time but G-Windows comes with
a fairly complete termcap file and that should make life easier. Wouldn't it?
John Brown
-*-
85568 10-FEB 18:40 OSK Applications
RE: SC (Re: Msg 85567)
From: MITHELEN To: BROWN80 (NR)
There is a version from Stephan Pashedag (?SP) (v6.1) that uses TERMCAP
instead of terminfo... I have a copy, but don't know where I got it from.
(probably from EFFO) Ken plans on releaseing an updated sc some day
(latest version) that will use termcap instead of terminfo.
-*-
End of Thread.
-*-
85561 10-FEB 00:40 General Information
SIM09 - 6809 Simulator
From: JES68K To: ALL
Has anyone else grabbed the 6809 Simulator program from Usenet and got it
to run? I executed it tonite and find it intriquing. C source for PC/Unix
was made available and the executable for a PC (which I used on my 386DX).
Rather nice to see the source for such a program. After using the CoCo2
Emulator recently ... these kind of programs have caught my attention.
=== Jesse ===
-*-
85569 10-FEB 21:14 General Information
RE: SIM09 - 6809 Simulator (Re: Msg 85561)
From: DSRTFOX To: JES68K
Jesse, what do you think it would take to get the 6809 emulator running like
a CoCo3? I guess we'd need a 6821 emulator, etc. ..... ;>
-*-
85573 11-FEB 00:04 General Information
RE: SIM09 - 6809 Simulator (Re: Msg 85569)
From: JES68K To: DSRTFOX (NR)
SIM09 is presently simulating a non-existant 6809 machine limited to the
address space of a 6809 (64K), with no disk interface (promised by the
author in future release), no special I/O devices. On a PC clone, I would
not want to say .... but if it was recompiled to run on say a 68000 based
machine with lots of linear address space, each I/O could be added on until
it approached the CoCo-2 .... after achieving that level of operation, a
person would have a much better idea of the difficulties of emulating a
more complex system like the CoCo-3.
Actually, I would expect simulation of a CoCo-2 capable of running OS9
Level 1 as the second step after getting it to simulate a CoCo-2 with
its I/O devices (or approximately what the CoCo2 Emulator program is right
now). The nice thing about SIM09 is it comes with C source code. But,
a real emulator would need to be coded in ML to ever hope to run as fast
as possible, but a C version would be okay to start with.
=== Jesse ===
-*-
End of Thread.
-*-
85562 10-FEB 00:48 OSK Applications
g-windows
From: ROYBUR To: EDELMAR
got a couple (or so) questions re g-windows for the SysIV, ed.
i don't know the status, but i had heard that NIMITZ may know about/may have
somebody doing a port of k-windows for the SysIV. if such a port comes to be,
AND if you do the port of g-windows for the mm/1 so that the two can work
together, would you also offer a similar version of g-windows for the SysIV;
i.e., g-windows for the SysIV that would cooperate with k-windows for the
SysIV?
secondly, i already have a mouse connected to T3. do you sell g-windows for
the SysIV without the mouse and new socket and if so, what's the price? if
not, what's the price anyway? 8*)
finally, if i buy g-windows now (and this is a LOT of "iffing"!) and later
you do make changes to allow g-windows to run under/with/whatever k-windows,
would i have to buy a whole new package, pay for an upgrade, or ???
i guess that's enough for now! <g>..............roy
-*-
85572 10-FEB 23:49 General Information
GaleForce
From: PHXKEN To: ALL
One of our club members is trying to reach Gale Force to possibly
purchase something. I tried the bbs there tonight but got no ans.
The club member tried the voice number today but received some
unknown interference. His last published address in an advertisement
was reported by the club member to reject snail mail.
Anyone know the best way to contact this old vendor?
phxken@nighthawk.stat.com
Farrell Kenimer @ FIDO 1:114/36
THANKS!!
-*-
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