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F I D O N E W S Volume 17, Number 36 04 Sep 2000
+----------------------------+---------------------------------------+
| The newsletter of the | ISSN 1198-4589 Published by: |
| FidoNet community | "FidoNews" |
| _ | 1-717-732-6820 1:270/720 |
| / \ | |
| /|oo \ | |
| (_| /_) | |
| _`@/_ \ _ | |
| | | \ \\ | Editor: Douglas Myers, 1:270/720 |
| | (*) | \ )) | DougM@paonline.com |
| |__U__| / \// | |
| _//|| _\ / | |
| (_/(_|(____/ | |
| (jm) | Newspapers should have no friends. |
| | -- JOSEPH PULITZER |
+----------------------------+---------------------------------------+
Table of Contents
1. EDITORIAL ................................................ 1
Robot with Attitude! ..................................... 1
2. COLUMNS .................................................. 5
Ol'WDB: Words of Love .................................... 5
3. NET HUMOR ................................................ 7
Democratic Demographics .................................. 7
4. COMIX IN ASCII ........................................... 9
Cow-asaki ................................................ 9
5. INTERNET INFO ............................................ 10
Fidonet-related sites .................................... 10
6. FIDONEWS INFO ............................................ 14
Masthead ................................................. 14
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 1 4 Sep 2000
=================================================================
EDITORIAL
=================================================================
Robot with Attitude!
Doug Myers
In the novella, Bicentennial Man (recently rendered as a Robin
Williams movie), science fiction Master Robert Heinlan depicted the
efforts of a robot to achieve humanity. In the latter half of
August, Thom LaCosta announced his own efforts to infuse the ELIST
ROBOT with the human feature of judgement:
----- Announcement in the Echo MODERATOR by Thom Lacosta -----
Effective immediately MOD UPD messages from third parties will NOT
be processed unless the echolist keeper has personal knowledge
and/or netmail/email from moderators that:
A. They have authorized a third party to update their listing
B. They have the password to the echo in question.
This policy has been instituted to insure the accuracy of the
echolist and to preserve the rights of the listed moderator.
Moderators using the services of third parties are strongly urged to
communicate with the echolist keeper that the conditions above apply
to their echoes.
For purposes of accuracy, all communications should specifically
list the echoes that are updated by a third party.
-----
In a past guest editorial in FIDONEWS, I defended the right of the
elist keeper to correct individual cases of chicanery with echo
listings... but I couldn't help but wonder if he'd bit off more than
he could chew with this policy.
I had two misgivings about this policy:
1. The policy assumes wrongdoing on the part of a third party
lister unless proven otherwise. This is a far different strategy
than the past policy of intervening when wrongdoing was actually
detected.
2. Though the stated purpose of the policy was to ensure accuracy
and protect the rights of moderators, it actually seemed like a
strategy to discourage or eliminate third party listers. In fact,
it brought to mind numerous arguments Thom had had with Bobby
Queen, Fidonet's premier echo lister. Could there be something
personal in all this?
The latter suspicion was confirmed in Thom's echomail response to
Ross Cassell...
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 2 4 Sep 2000
----- Echomail from area MODERATOR -----
Yes Sir! As a matter of fact, a recent series of events was
triggered by a change in moderators. I noticed that a third party
had been updating the listing for several months, using the original
moderator's name. The updater then changed the moderator.
I asked both the original moderator and the updater to confirm that
the original moderator had transfered the echo.
Amazingly, the original moderator said he hadn't, and the updater
said that since the echo was his, he could name anyone as moderator.
It's apparent that while a third-party may have a password, that
does NOT give that person the right or standing to make substantial
changes to the content of an echo tag listing.
From my viewpoint, it may represent fraud, gross mis-undrstanding of
the echolist, general confusion about rules, but none-the-less, it's
something that can not be tolerated.
-----
Though the above rationale is stated in a generalized manner,
subsequent echomail brought out that Bobby Queen was indeed the
target of Thom LaCosta's new policy:
----- Echomail from Bobby Queen to Thom LaCosta, MODERATOR -----
TL> I am trying to recontruct what went on with the Hockey Echo.
TL> My files indicate the following:
TL> The echo listing was deleted on 4/1/2000 due to a lack of an
TL> update.
Yep
TL> On May 7, 1999 you "rescued" the echo, showing Daryl Turner,
TL> the previously listed moderator as moderator.
True
TL> On June 5 and July 10, 2000 you updated the echolisting, still
TL> showing Daryl Turner as moderator.
All the while trying to contact Daryl via CRASHED NetMail to get the
echo turned back over to him.
TL> On August 6, 2000 you updated the echo showing Michael Grant
TL> as moderator.
True
TL> Can you supply me with copies of any communmications from Daryl
TL> Turner showing that he either gave you control of the echo, or
TL> confirmation that he had turned the echo over to Michael Grant?
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 3 4 Sep 2000
If I had any responses from Daryl either to my NetMails or via email
he could have kept the echo himself. The problem was I told him via
NetMail that someone else had asked to moderate the echo and for 3
months I got no response to any of my messages and Michael CRASHED
his system also asking him. So we know his system was accepting the
NetMail messages but he was not responding in any way. So I picked
a new moderator for an echo I had rescued.
TL> If that information is not available, do you have anything that
TL> would substantiate that you had the authority to remove Mr. Turner
TL> as the listed moderator and substitute Mr. Grant in his place?
The authority was that in letting the echo slip Daryl gave up his
right to the echo as you yourself has said in various echos
including MODERATOR. I kept him listed until after 3 months I could
not contact him and the echo was in need of a moderator and was on
the low traffic report and in danger of being totally deleted from
the Z1B Backbone. Michael had contacted me and I had given Daryl
over a month to contact me after I sent him CRASHED NetMail letting
him know that Michael wanted to take over the echo.
Point is the echo was MINE and I chose a new moderator. PERIOD!
-----
I don't suppose that I owe Thom LaCosta either editorial support or
editorial opposition. In the past, I was openly supportive of his
role in thwarting Zorch Frezberg's attempt to retain the echo
FN_SYSOP under the guise of "echo trustee." I was also openly
critical of Tom Knowles "echo rescuing" attempts on the suspicion
that he and Thom LaCosta were actually the same person. I suppose,
in the interest of balance, I should be wishy washy on this
particular issue.
In this spirit of no firm convictions, I've similarly never formed
an image of Bobby Queen. He could be a bottom feeding echo
scavenger, as Thom LaCosta and others have portrayed him in the
past... or he could be the heroic echo rescuer which he claims to
be. The fact is that Bobby mainly traffics in echoes which would
have been lost to Fidonet anyway. Certainly, I wouldn't care to
expend the effort he does in determining the echoes which are about
to expire, and then listing them himself. Whether he restores them
to the original moderator, claims them for himself, or acts as an
echoGod in determining a new moderator seems only of academic
interest.
Despite my lack of firmness above, however, I believe the new
echolist policy is more an argument between Bobby Queen and Thom
LaCosta than a matter of principle. At the very least, it seems the
wrong example on which to base policy. It seems that Bobby is being
chastised more on a technicality than on any actual wrongdoing.
It seems that Bobby had the authority to list Daryl Turner as
moderator of the HOCKEY echo when Daryl left it expire through his
own inaction, but doesn't have the authority to list Michael Grant
as moderator as Daryl continues his inaction. The technicality is
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 4 4 Sep 2000
that Bobby didn't list himself as moderator when he listed the
expired echo, and thus placed himself in the dreaded category of
"third party lister" when he attempted to nominate an active
moderator.
I don't know Daryl and I don't read the HOCKEY echo... but the
echomail quoted seems to indicate that Daryl couldn't be bothered
with the echo for six months during which the echo expired, and
three months thereafter. I'm not sure that the "accuracy" of the
elist is being preserved by perpetuating the "rights" of a moderator
who, in fact, didn't moderate for nine months. I'm not sure the
"rights" are worth preserving.
Above all, I'm not sure I want a policy which establishes a "big
brother" to monitor all elist submissions for such technical
violations. This is nothing personal against Thom LaCosta... I
suppose he'd make as good a "big brother" as anyone else... but "big
brothers" have been known to slow the growth of the little guys.
If there's been an actual violation of the rights of Daryl Turner
which isn't evidenced by the echomail so far, then let Thom do what
he sees as right to correct the problem. But the self-promotion to
"big brother" seems like overkill here.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 5 4 Sep 2000
=================================================================
COLUMNS
=================================================================
Ol'WDB's Column
wdbonner@pacbell.net
My good friend's daughter writes these words of love to her Dad,
which with pride, he shares with all of us:
Elusive As The Wind
by Martha Crowninshield O'Brien
Love is a powerful thing.
Elusive as the wind, as magical as
Christmas Eve and songs that make you cry...
Its touch is such that nothing
can begin to describe or do justice to it.
Love leaves us seeking more, like
crisp autumn leaves afire with color,
and that one last glimpse of setting summer sun...
When it's lost or wounded, as a bird
struck from the sky in midflight,
it's as though the rain will never end,
and the world seems dark and lonely;
door braced shut against wicked
winter wind, our hearts as icy as
late February snow...
We are sad waiting for the sun, and
too often believe we will never love again...
Always though, against all odds,
there remains a tiny spark, not unlike
a firefly fluttering lazily through a
steamy August evening, ready to ignite
perhaps, a future flame, a lasting love...
Thank you for the time spent sharing
your heart and opening mine to the
sweet possibility that I might love again...
Sad to leave a special future to
begin a distant past, but I have loved
you as best I could, as you did me,
and I wish you Love, wonder and
starlight, always....
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Abstract Thinking
by
Martha Jean Crowninshield
Windswept sand hills looking up
to sun-kissed skies of powder blue,
shifting calmly day to day
with constant footprints trudging through.
As waves, in sequence, pound the shore
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 6 4 Sep 2000
and distant seagulls cry above,
shy wind whirls tumble through the haze,
a pleasant, tickling type of shove.
Distinction ends though at the sea,
and as if caught within some bond,
I notice with a startling thought
that it goes on and on.....and on!
Copyright 1999 Martha Crowninshield O'Brien
Used by Permission, Ol'WDB
-----------------------------------------------------------------
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 7 4 Sep 2000
=================================================================
NET HUMOR
=================================================================
Democratic Demographics
Thanks to Roy Reed
Virtually anyone can be a Democrat. Just simply quit thinking and
vote that way. But if you want to be a GOOD Democrat, there are some
prerequisites you must have first. Compare the below and see how you
rate.
1. You have to believe the AIDS virus is spread by a lack of federal
funding.
2. You have to believe that the same teacher who can't teach 4th
graders how to read is somehow qualified to teach those same kids
about sex.
3. You have to believe that guns, in the hands of law-abiding
Americans, are more of a threat than U.S. nuclear weapons
technology, in the hands of Chinese communists.
4. You have to believe that there was no art before Federal funding.
5. You have to believe that global temperatures are less affected by
cyclical, documented changes in the earth's climate, and more
affected by yuppies driving SUVs.
6. You have to believe that gender roles are artificial but being
homosexual is natural.
7. You have to be against capital punishment but support abortion on
demand.
8. You have to believe that businesses create oppression and
governments create prosperity.
9. You have to believe that hunters don't care about nature, but
loony activists from Seattle do.
10. You have to believe that self-esteem is more important than
actually doing something to earn it.
11. You have to believe the military, not corrupt politicians, start
wars.
12. You have to believe the NRA is bad, because it supports certain
parts of the Constitution, while the ACLU is good, because it
supports certain parts of the Constitution.
13. You have to believe that taxes are too low, but ATM fees are too
high.
14. You have to believe that Margaret Sanger and Gloria Steinmen are
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 8 4 Sep 2000
more important to American history than Thomas Jefferson, General
Robert E. Lee or Thomas Edison.
15. You have to believe that standardized tests are racist, but
racial quotas and set-asides aren't.
16. You have to believe Hillary Clinton is really a lady.
17. You have to believe that the only reason socialism hasn't worked
anywhere it's been tried, is because the right people haven't been
in charge.
18. You have to believe Republicans telling the truth belong in
jail, but a liar and sex offender belongs in the White House.
19. You have to believe that homosexual parades displaying drag,
transvestites and bestiality should be constitutionally protected
and manger scenes at Christmas should be illegal.
20. You have to believe that illegal Democratic party funding by the
Chinese is somehow in the best interest of the United States.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 9 4 Sep 2000
=================================================================
COMIX IN ASCII
=================================================================
(__)
(oo)
______ ______\/
__|______\__/____/\\[}
/ --- \\ ---
|[] / \ \ / / \
| @ | \____/ | @ |
\ / \ /
--- ---
COW-ASAKI
-----------------------------------------------------------------
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 10 4 Sep 2000
=================================================================
INTERNET INFO
=================================================================
. -- -- -- -- --- -- -- -- -- .
| FIDONET-RELATED SITES |
` -- -- -- -- --- -- -- -- -- '
Last update: July 16, 2000
FidoNet
Homepage: http://www.fidonet.org
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ftp://ftp.sstar.com/fidonet/fnews/
Echolist: http://www.baltimoremd.com/echolist/
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SDS Files: http://fidobbs.dk/download (Web Access to SDS)
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ftp://ftp.sstar.com/fidonet/zone2 (Z2 nodelists etc.)
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Fido-IP: http://home.nrh.de/fido/ (English/German)
Region 25: http://www.literary.freeserve.co.uk/net2502/
Region 26: http://www.nemesis.ie
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 11 4 Sep 2000
REC 26: http://www.nrgsys.com/orb
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http://Welcome.to/skynetbbs/
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! Net422: http://www.fido.sk (Slovak/English)
Region 50: http://www.fido7.com/ (Russian)
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Zone 3: http://www.z3.fidonet.org
Zone 4:
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Region 90:
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(Chinese)
Fidonet Via Internet Hubs
See also: http://www.osirusoft.com/fidoip.html
a @ preceding an individual's name implies a virtual email
address. The email is translated as follows
firstlast@osirusoft.com will automatically route to the
appropriate individual's email. Anyone in this list will
also receive routed notice of this feature. In my case, it
would still be joejared@osirusoft.com, but you get the idea.
Also, as information is provided to me, I will be adding a
latency field to each node, which is defined as the maximum
time between when the message is received, and when it is
sent on to other nodes, or available to be sent onward,
defined in minutes. A latency of ! implies that there is an
immediate response, and an attempt to deliver immediately
after processing, or a "MinuteMail System", as it were.
v-email flag firstnamelastname@osirusoft.com
| email address or
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 12 4 Sep 2000
Node# | Operator | Facilities (*) | Speed,| Basic Rate
| | |latency|
-----------+-------------------+----------------+-------+------------
Zone 1 | | | |
10/3 @ Brenda Donovan | FTP,UUE,BinkP | 384K,30| n/c
10/345 @ Todd Cochrane | FTP,BinkP,VMOT | T1,! | n/c
12/12 @ Ken Wilson | FTP | T1 | $24mo.
13/25 @ Jim Balcom | FTP | 56k | $20mo.
103/5 @ Mark Luetger | BinkP | 384k,!| n/c
103/153 @ Michael Box | BinkP | aDSL,!| n/c
103/301 @ Joe Jared | BinkP,FTP,NFS | 384k,!| n/c
103/401 @ Warren Bonner | BinkP | aDSL,!| n/c
105/8 | Russ Johnson | FTP,BinkP,VMoT | 384k | n/c
105/72 @ Larry James | FTP, BinkP | aDSL | $50/yr
106/1 @ Steve Loupe | BinkP, FTP | 128k | ???
106/6018 | Lawrence Garvin | FTP, VMoT | aDSL,60| n/c
107/453 @ Jeffrey Estevez| FTP,BinkP,VMoT,UUE| 56k,60| $10 mo.
140/1 @ Bob Seaborn | FTP,BinkP | T3,30 | $5/$16
167/133 | Stephen Monteith | BinkP | 128k+ | n/c
211/417 @ Korombos | BinkP,UUE,FTP | T1 | n/c
218/109 @ Matt Munson | BinkP,UUE | 33.6k | n/c
244/2 | Kari Suomela | FTP,VMoT,BinkP,UUE| T1,! | $25.00/mo
246/160 @ Mason Vye | FTP, UUE | 56K | n/c
280/169 | Brian Greenstreet | FTP | 33.6 | $2mo.
342/3 @ Richard Dodsworth | BinkP,FTP | 128K+ | n/c
395/670 | Arthur Stark | BinkD,FTP | 128k | n/c
396/1 @ John Souvestre | FTP,VMoT | T1,10 | $5/mo
396/45 | Marc Lewis | UUE | 33.6 | $26/yr
2604/104 @ Jim Mclaughlin | FTP,VMoT,UUE | 33.6 | $1mo
2613/404 @ David Moufarrege | BinkP,FTP,VMoT | 128k+,!| n/c
2624/306 @ David Calafrancesco | VMoT | 33.6 | n/c
3613/2 @ jyates@bsdi.ldl.net | UUE | 28.8 | n/c
3632/84 | Robert Todd |FTP,VMoT,UUE,BinkP | 57.6k | n/c
3639/93 @ Ross Cassell | FTP, BinkP |128K+,!| n/c
3651/9 @ Jerry Gause | FTP,VMoT | 33.6 | $3/$6
--------------------------------------------------------------
Zone 2 |
20/11 | Henrik Lindhe | BinkP | ??? | n/c
31/1 | Gabriel Plutzar | BinkP | T1+ | n/c
203/600 | Mikael Karlsson | UUE | 64k | n/c
221/360 @ Tommi Koivula | BinkP,UUE | ??? | n/c
236/205 @ Michael Kaaber | BinkP | ??? | n/c
246/2098 | Volker Imre | BinkP | ??? | n/c
284/800 @ Jeroen VanDeLeur | FTP,UUE | 64k | n/c
292/620 | Eddy Missoul | VMoT, UUE | 64k |N/C
292/624 | Steven Leeman | UUE | 64k | N/C
292/2003 | Eric Vaneberck | BinkP | 768k | n/c
301/1 | Peter Witschi | BinkP | 768k | n/c
332/807 | Roberto Mascolo | BinkP | ??? | n/c
335/535 @ Mario Mure | BinkP,VMot,UUE | 64k | n/c
335/610 | Gino Lucrezi | UUE | 33.6 | n/c
344/201 | Julio Garcia | BinkP | ??? | n/c
346/3 @ Carlos Navarro | UUE | ??? | n/c
382/100 | Sinisa Burina | BinkP | ??? | n/c
406/555 | Ofir Michaeli & | BinkP | ??? | n/c
406/555 | Marius Kaizerman | BinkP | ??? | n/c
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 13 4 Sep 2000
423/81 | Milos Bajer | BinkP | ??? | n/c
464/4077 | Serguei Trouchelle| UUE | 19.2 | n/c
465/204 | Va Milushnikov | BinkP | 33.6k | n/c
469/84 | Max Masyutin | VMoT | 256k | n/c
480/112 | Adam Sarapata| FTP, VMoT, UUE,BinkP| 128k | n/c
2411/413 @ Dennis Dittrich | UUE,BinkP | 64k | n/c
2446/301 @ Lothar Behet | BinkP,VMoT,UUE,FTP | 64K | n/c
2474/275 | Christian Emig | UUE | 64k | unkn
5030/115 | Andrey Podkolzin | BinkP | ??? | n/c
5100/8 | Egons Bush | BinkP | ??? | n/c
5020/1159 | Gennady Kudryashoff | UUE | 33.6 | n/c
--------------------------------------------------------------
Zone 3
633/260 @ Malcolm Miles | FTP,BinkP | 64K | n/c
640/954 | Rick Van Ruth | FTP,VMot,UUE,BinkP| 56K| n/c
774/605 @ Barry Blackford|BinkP,VMoT:10023,ifcico,FTP |33.6| n/c
--------------------------------------------------------------
Zone 4
905/100 | Fabian Gervan | VMoT,UUE,BinkP | 128k | n/c
902/18 | Javier Tejedor | UUE | 33,6 | n/c
--
* FTP = Internet File Transfer Protocol
* VMoT = Virtual Mailer over Telnet (various)
* UUE = uuencode<->email type transfers
* BinkP = front end mailer for TCPIP networks
* NFS = Linux Networking
----------------------------------------------
Fidonet oriented news servers
news.osirusoft.com
news.tardis.net
Fidonet oriented chat rooms.
room #fidonet 5PM (PDT 11AM GMT) Sundays
irc.osirusoft.com (Peers wanted)
----------------------------------------------
Please send updates, corrections and suggestions to
Joe Jared, 1:103/301, joejared@osirusoft.com. All email addresses
here for purpose of corresponding with fidonet members about
obtaining a feed. Improper use of the virtual email addresses, and
most especially, email addressed to blockme@relays.osirusoft.com
will be considered a request to be blocked by my open relay spam
stopper at http://relays.osirusoft.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 14 4 Sep 2000
=================================================================
FIDONEWS INFO
=================================================================
Masthead
+ -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- FIDONEWS STAFF - -- -- -- -- -- -- -- +
| |
| Editor: Douglas Myers, 1:270/720, DougM@paonline.com |
| Webmaster: Jim Barchuk, jb@fidonews.org |
| Columnist: Joe Jared, 1:103/0, jarhead@osirusoft.com |
| (Fido Via Internet Hubs column) |
| Columnist: Warren D. Bonner, 1:103/401, wdbonner@pacbell.net |
| (Warren uses the pen name "Ol'WDB") |
| Humor: Roy Reed, rcreedv@juno.com |
| Features: Frank Vest, 1:124/6308.1 |
| |
+ -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- +
+ -- -- -- -- -- -- -- - EDITORS EMERITI - -- -- -- -- -- -- -- +
| |
| Tom Jennings, Thom Henderson, Dale Lovell, Vince |
| Perriello, Tim Pozar, Sylvia Maxwell, Donald Tees, |
| Christopher Baker, Zorch Frezberg, Henk Wolsink |
| |
+ -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- +
"Fido", "FidoNet" and the dog-with-diskette are U.S. registered
trademarks of Tom Jennings, P.O. Box 410923, San Francisco, CA
94141, and are used with permission.
Fidonews is published weekly by and for the members of Fidonet.
Fidonews is Copyright (C) 2000 by Douglas Myers, though authors
retain rights to their contributed articles. Opinion expressed by
the authors is strictly their own. Noncommercial duplication and
distribution within Fidonet is encouraged. Authors are encouraged
to send their articles in ASCII text to Douglas Myers at one of his
addresses above.
The weekly edition of Fidonews is distributed through the file area
FIDONEWS, and is published as echomail in the echo FIDONEWS. These
sources are normally available through your Network Coordinator.
The current and past issues are also available from the following
sources:
+ -- -- -- -- -- -- - FIDONEWS AVAILABILITY - -- -- -- -- -- -- +
| |
| Freq FIDONEWS @ 1:270/720, 1:140/1, or 1:396/1 |
| ftp://ftp.sstar.com/fidonet/fnews/ |
| ftp://ftp.nwstar.com/fidonet/fidonews/ |
| http://www.fidonews.org |
| email subscription: majordomo@fidonews.org |
| (subject: help body: list) |
| ftp mail: ftpmail@fidonews.org (subject: help) |
| |
+ -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- +
FIDONEWS 17-36 Page 15 4 Sep 2000
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